The Spira Family; Broken Spira Branches

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The following is a list of Spira branches, and in some cases, just leaves, that have fallen from our tree. They are known to be related, but in most cases, the exact connection is no longer known.




• Naftali & Yechiel Schonfeld.
From: "Larry R. Feder" <lrfeder@home.com> 
To: <moishe@langsam.com> 
Subject: Bnei Yissoschor 
Date: Thu, 2 Nov 2000 20:04:28 -0600 
X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 


Dear Mr. Miller                                                    B"H
    I have been meaning to write you for a very long time.  As a matter of 
	fact, I think I once spoke to you when I was in NY visiting my brother, 
	Chaiim Baruch (Harry) Schonfeld.  Anyway, we've always heard from our 
	father, Moshe, A"H, and from other relatives, that we were descended from 
	the Bnei Yissoschor.v  However, noone seems to know how.  I've asked and 
	asked.  Some versions I've heard "shtimt nisht".  Maybe because you've 
	done much more research than I have, and are more well versed with 
	Seforim, you would know.
    
	A 2nd cousin of mine, a Margareten (ben Hinda Schonfeld Margareten) 
	reportedly went to the Blushever, z"l, andd asked him if we are related 
	to the B"Y and he answered "Avada" (certainly). 
	
    Also, to change the subject somewhat, could you tell me about the 
	Miller-Schonfeld connection.  We had several occassions to speak with family 
	members of Pesach Dovid Schonfeld, A"H, but unfortunately all those 
	occassions were when we or they were sitting Shiva.  We are related to that 
	family through 2 different connections.
    
	Anyway, here is our Yichus-please let me know what you know, and I will do 
	likewise:
 
    My father:   Moshe Schonfeld                
	           + Pesel Lifshe Goldberger (a Lisker grandchild)
      gfather    Chaim Baruch Schonfeld         
	           + Malya Weinberger
     ggfather    Naftali Yeshaya Asher Schonfeld
	           + Esther Wohl, 
	             Shprintza Shaindel Wohl (Hanucovce)
    gggfather    Menachem Mendel Schonfeld      
	           + Sora Blima ?
   ggggfather    Eliezer Schonfeld              
               + ?
 
                               Looking forward to hearing from you,
                               Elizabeth Feder
______________________________________________________________________

From: "Larry R. Feder" <lrfeder@home.com> 
To: <moishe@langsam.com> 
Subject: Re: Spira 
Date: Sat, 4 Nov 2000 20:41:58 -0600 
X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 


Dear Moishe,
    I did look at the website, and did not see any apparent connection.
    I can provide several tiny hints regarding the Q of our connection to
the Bnei Yissoschor, and also the dates, as you asked.  Unfortunately, these
hints have not helped me discover the answer, but nevertheless:
(1)  In talking to my father A"H's first cousin, she said she thought the
connection was through the mother.  The Wohl sisters, who were wives to
Naftali Yeshaya Asher (I am named for them)  were descended from Shaul Wahl,
the Polish king for a day.  Their parents were Yaakov Yehuda and Rivka bas
Moshe Chaim (maiden name unknown) Wohl.
(2)  When I was in Israel this past summer, I met another branch of the
family for the first time.  They are descendants of Naftali's brother
Yechiel Mechel Schonfeld, who lived in Uhely.  They said they did not get
the "Kabbala" that their branch stems from the B"Y, but were knowlegeable
that that Naftali & Yechiel's uncle, Moshe, was the B"Y's son-in-law.


The dates:
My father, obm Moshe Schonfeld, b. **** in Cz, d. Pesach ****
Gfather Chaim Baruch b, 1879, d. 1929
Naftali Yeshaya Asher Schonfeld b. about 1840, d. Av, 1920

Thanks,

Elizabeth Feder
_______________________________________________________________________________
From: "Louis Schonfeld"  
To:  
Subject: RE: Stropkov Schonfeld 
Date: Wed, 8 Nov 2000 08:47:21 -0500 
X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) 
Importance: Normal 


This too is in process. Are you aware of the family of Naftali Yeshaye Asher
Schonfeld from Hanusovce nad Taplou? The secular documents refer to him as
Nathan, and he is also called Naftali by contemporaries. His father was
Menachem Mendel (or some variant) who is assumed to be the brother of Moshe
Schonfeld from Medzilaborce. The family has a Tzavah from NYA which states
that they are descendants of the B.Y. Not necessariyly from Moshe ben
Eliezer but from another daughter. Elizabeth Schonfeld Feder is their family
historian. Her brothers Louis Schonfeld (Yekutiel) lives in Flatbush (less
than 5 minutes away from you) and Baruch Schonfeld also from Flatbush.  I
mentioned your name to her. Also, fee free to use my "Schonfeld subscriber"
list to disseminate any relevant information you wish. All the individuals
who I have mentioned plus a number of others are on this list.


Best
Louie
______________________________________________________________________
From: "Larry R. Feder"  
To:  
Subject: Re: Many new Schonfeld descendants added 
Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2000 10:24:40 -0600 
X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 


Dear Moishe,
    I just read your e-mail & am on my way out-don't have time to elaborate
now, but IY"H I will give you the details later on the Neuman connection-it
is a definite one.  I was going to contact my mother A"H's landsman(lady)
from Hukliva today to ask her to help, because I know from when she visited
with my mother, they remembered each other's families.  Now I will wait
until you & I correspond a bit more.
    I also translitereated Neuman several ways, not knowing which is is
current use- but having Neumans on both sides of my family, I used one for
one side and one for the other.
    I"YH details to follow.
Elizabeth Schonfeld Feder- Chicago
______________________________________________________________________
From: "Larry R. Feder"  
To:  
Subject: Re: Many new Schonfeld descendants added 
Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2000 20:05:16 -0600 
X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 





Dear Moishe,
       Our family is descended on my mother's side from the Lisker Rav, R.
Tzvi Hersh Friedman, of Olaszliska, Hungary.  My mother's maiden name was
Goldberger, direct line from Yoizef Goldberger, son -in -law of the Lisker
(author of Ach Pri T'vua and HaYoshor V'Hatov-more on that later). I only
wish our connection to the Bnei Yissochor was as clear.  I will fill in the
missing information that I know offhand, as I don't have time to look up
trees, charts, and birth records right now.  I will fill in what I know in
CAPS, so that it will be easy for you to see what I've added.
    I also forwarded your message to another family member, and told him to
respond to you as able.
> Descendants of Chana Mindel Uri
>
>          1       Chana Mindel Uri
> ..              +Tzvi Newman
> .........       2       Naftali Yeshaya Hertz Newman    1888 - 1952
> .............           +Ettel GOLDBERGER> .........               *2nd
Wife of Nathan Newman:
> .............           +Krantcha GOLDBERGER? (A SISTER TO ETTEL)
> ....................    3       Yosef Newman
> ............................... 4       Tcharna Faiga Newman
> ............................... 4       Chana Mindel Newman
> ............................... 4       Maxi Newman
> ....................    3       Chana Mindel Newman (MARGIE)
> ........................                +Pesach Dovid Schonfeld 1910 -
2000
> ....................    3       Herschel Newman
> ....................    3       Gittel Leah Newman
> ....................    3       Louie Newman - RACHI
> .........       2       Perri Newman
> .............           +boy Klein
> ....................    3       child Klein
> ....................    3       Tzvi Klein
> ............................... 4       Avrohm Dovid Klein
> .........       2       Shea Newman
> .........       2       Yankel Newman
                Louis Newman has another brother name Ari, married to a
SHUStERMAN, currently lives in Fla., a sister Nellie (Krantche) married name
 Auerbach.
            Together, we can probably piece together more of this.
                                                                Regards,
Elizabeth
______________________________________________________________________
From: "Larry R. Feder"  
To:  
Subject: Newman family clarification & corrections 
Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2000 21:27:41 -0600 
X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 


Dear Moishe,
    I made a mistake.  Herschel Newman is married to a Shusterman & living in Fla.
	Ari passed away several yrs ago. 
	I have Chana Mindel Uri's son listed as Shaya Naftali, not Naftali Shaya.If you
	don't know of any family members to consult about this, I could probably find
	someone to ask, although I am not in direct, constant contact with them.My aunt
	is.
    A key Q for you, which would hint at a lot of info:  Do you know who Naftali 
	Yeshaya (or reversed) was named after? Again, my Schonfeld Ggrandfather was
	Naftali Yeshaya Asher, and I don't know of an antecedent with that name, though
	I can go back 2 more generations.  What about the town of origin?  My Newman
	source tells me the Newmans came from Uhely.
    Also, your birthdate for NYH of 1888 seems wrong-or my dob for Ettel of 1863 is
	wrong. Let's check on that if we can.
    At this point I am still in the process of researching & entering Newman family
	names.  
                                                    Regards, Elizabeth
_____________________________________________________________________________
From: "Larry R. Feder"  
To:  
Subject: Re: Neuman- Gldberger-Lisker 
Date: Thu, 16 Nov 2000 21:18:04 -0600 
X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 



----- Original Message -----
From: 
To: "Larry R. Feder" 
Sent: Wednesday, November 15, 2000 6:24 AM
Subject: Re: Many new Schonfeld descendants added



> What is your OWN lineage in this tree?
> -Moishe
> Ettel & Krantche were sisters to Zalman Leib Goldberger, who was my
mother's father.  Krantche is a very common name in the Lisker family, as
that was the Rebbetzin's name.
______________________________________________________________________
From: "Larry R. Feder"  
To:  
Subject: Re: Neuman- Gldberger-Lisker 
Date: Mon, 20 Nov 2000 06:50:16 -0600 
X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 



----- Original Message -----
From: 
To: "Larry R. Feder" 
Sent: Thursday, November 16, 2000 10:17 PM
Subject: Re: Neuman- Gldberger-Lisker



> Who were Ettel, Krantche and Zalman Leib's parents?
Aharon Goldberger & Gendendel (Nanci) Lefkovits
> Do you have dates for when they were born or at least age order? Sorry,
No.  I do know that Zalman Lieb (Lajos, legally,) was born April, 1885.  The
rest I'm still working on.
>
    Do you know after whom Shaya Naftali Hertz was named?  My
great-grandfather on the Schonfeld side was Naftali Yeshaya Asher Schonfeld,
and I am trying to
see where a connection might be.
    Also, the Lisker sefer that I mentioned has lots of info in it.  It is
currently out of print, and I am trying to get access to it and to get the
pertintent gen. pages xeroxed.  So far, I haven't had success with that.  I
had an unexpected opportunity to see that sefer for a short time this past
summer, and was not in a position to take proper advantage of the
opportunity.
    I will IY"H be seeing my aunt & uncle in mid- Dec, and hope to clarify
some of this.


Kol Tuv, Elizabeth
______________________________________________________________________


• Tzvi Elimelech Schonfeld


Date: Sat, 05 Feb 2000 16:02:48 -0500
To: Marge Schechner <momcactus@email.com>
From: moishe@langsam.com <moishe@langsam.com>
Subject: Re: Schonfeld
Bcc: moishe@langsam.com

Hi,
Thanks for your response. You should be aware that Zvi Elimelech's (Hersh Mylech) 
namesake was the famed R' Hersh Mylech Spira, author of various books, the most 
famous entitled "Bnei Yissochur", for which he is known. He lived from 
1783 - 1841. Can your datres fit with your g-grandfather being born then (>1841) 
instead of 1820-1830?
-Moishe

At 01:34 PM 2/3/00 -0500, you wrote:
Hi,
 I wish I could help with this one but the only one that I know of is my grandfather,
 Moses (Moshe). For some reason,no one in the family knows the names of any of his 
 siblings, just that Zvi was from Hungary and born somewhere in the 1820-30 range.
 Zvi had died by 1896 since the first child to my grandparents was a boy named Hersh 
 Melech who died shortly after birth and was born in 1896. I know the names of a few 
 of his siblings children who were my grandfather's age. One of his siblings sons
 (obviously a brother) was Abe Schonfeld who accompanied my grandmother here in 1912, 
 June or so to New York  and two sisters, Esther Weisman and  Fannie Goldberg, who 
 were about my grandmother's age so born about 1875 to another of his siblings but
 dont know if they were Schoenfelds by maiden name or not.

Marge


Hi,
Can we start in the beginning? Can you list (in age order?) the children 
from each of R' Zvi Elimelech's marriages? For women, can you add their 
married names?
Do you have a genelogical report out of a program like Family Tree Maker or 
such?
-Moishe
-----------------------------------------------
Date: Sun, 06 Feb 2000 12:17:38 -0500
To: Marge Schechner <momcactus@email.com>
From: moishe@langsam.com <moishe@langsam.com>
Subject: RE: Re: Schonfeld

Hi,
How do you know it was 1867?
-Moishe

At 11:45 AM 2/6/00 -0500, you wrote:
The only thing that I can add is that my grandfather was the 8th of 10 children 
from the second marriage and he was born in 1867 so if R'Hersh 
Mylech Spira died in 1841, then my great grandfather would have 
been born then and fathered 10 children by the time he was 26 in 
1867, when my grandfather was born. Possible, but not likely,
unless a lot of them died in infancy and another was produced in 
less than a year. I wish I knew.

Marge
------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Sun, 06 Feb 2000 14:36:53 -0500
To: Marge Schechner <momcactus@email.com>
From: moishe@langsam.com <moishe@langsam.com>
Subject: RE: RE: Re: Schonfeld

Thanks for the reply. One more question. What year was his first child born?


At 05:09 PM 2/6/00 -0500, you wrote:
Hi,
 He told my mother and the other children that he was born in "yar sieben 'n' 
 sechtzig".
Marge
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Wed, 1 Nov 2000 14:42:50 -0500 (EST) 
From: Marge Schechner <momcactus@email.com> 
To: Louis Schonfeld <Lmagyar@en.com>, Robert Schoenfeld <robert@liii.com>, 
        S. Rubens <rub1@owl-online.de>, 
        Sharon Schonfeld Weisz <w3@compuserve.com>, 
        Touvia Goldstein <touviagoldstein@yahoo.com>, 
        Y. Pedhazur <ypedhazur@hotmail.com>, Larry Feder <com>, 
        M.Schoenfeld <Marc.Schoenfeld@thegarden.com>, 
        Michael Schonfeld <awa@netvision.net.il>, 
        Moishe Miller <moishe@langsam.com>, Paul Leyton <pleyton@sierra.net>, 
        Philip Schoenfeld <schoney@midwest.net>, 
        Pinchas Schoenfield <Bodedut@att.net>, Robert <Brown1Dog@aol.com>, 
        Ben Korda <korda@freenet.edmonton.ab.ca>, 
        Bennett Greenspan <bcg@usernet.com>, 
        Carlos S <carlos_schonfeld@yahoo.com>, 
        Eugen Schoenfeld <socexs@panther.Gsu.EDU>, Fried <Friedcpa@aol.com>, 
        Gary Katz <katzgary@home.com>, Gary M. Katz <gmkatz@aimnet.com>, 
        Havas <Munkacs@aol.com>, Ian G. <GrinblatI@SarinaRusso.com.au>, 
        J. Coriat <julia.coriat@wanadoo.fr>, Jorand A. <jordan@sifry.com>, 
        Joseph Lebovics <lebotor@pathcom.com>, 
        Joseph Lebovics <lebotor@tor.axxent.ca>, 
        Klaus und Dina <kuehnekd@swissonline.ch>, Kuhne <kuehnekd@freesurf.ch>, 
        L <Lnsg@aol.com> 
Subject: RE: Forum for Schonfeld genealogy 
X-Mailer: mail.com 
X-Originating-IP: 24.6.179.52 


Hi all,
This is a wonderful idea of Louis's. Here is my Schoenfeld tree:
I am Marge Neff Schechner, daughter of Sylvia Schoenfeld Neff. She is the
youngest of seven children of Moses (and Rose Schreier) Schoenfeld, who was
born in Boryslav(then Austria) in 1867, the 8th of 10 children of Tzvi
Elimelech and Bella Richter Schoenfeld. Tzvi had another wife before Bella
with whom he had two children who he left with his former in laws somewhere
in Hungary. He then married Bella and had another 8 children with her. My
Tzvi antecendent died sometime around 1920. Since my grandfather, Moses,was
the 8th of 10 children, I can assume that Tzvi was born sometime around
1825-1830. Unfortunately, I don't know the names of any of my grandfather's
siblings. He had a nephew named Abraham Schoenfeld, who was born about 1890
and married a woman named Rose, and a niece named Esther who married a man
named Moishe Weisman. They had 3 children named Irving,Hannah(born about
1912) and Belle who married a man named Harold Cole(Cohen. Another niece was
Esther Zukerman (born about1890) who married a man named Max Magid.



Marge Schechner



-----------------------------------------------
From: Louis Schonfeld <Lmagyar@en.com> 
To: <moishe@langsam.com> 
Subject: RE: Tzvi Elimelech Schonfeld - Were there TWO?! 
Date: Wed, 1 Nov 2000 07:45:49 -0500 
X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) 
Importance: Normal 


Moishe,


I don't know where it fits. If you wish to make a Schonfeld section within
your website that would be good. I
would refer all Schonfeld correspondance to that site and encourage them to
send you postings. I would also advertise
that site to all relevant parties. I would ask you to make the Schonfeld
branch as prominent on your site as the Spira section. I sent you the Gedcom
version earlier this morning.


BEst wishes,


Louis




-----Original Message-----
From: Louis Schonfeld [mailto:Lmagyar@en.com]
Sent: Wednesday, November 01, 2000 5:37 AM
To: moishe@langsam.com
Subject: RE: Tzvi Elimelech Schonfeld - Were there TWO?!



I had been in touch with Marge S in the past, but never received such
extensive data. There is another Hersh Meileh Schonfeld
said to have come from Stropkov. This data is from Julia Coriat and her
cousin in German (an Israeli now living there)This Hersh Meilech was born in
about 1803 and lived in the Kosice area and died in Vienna. I have more
details, but there must be
a better way than this for us to keeping repeating ourselves. There is a
Schonfeld web page, but it was started by non-Jewish Schonfelds from
Germany, even though there has been some Jewish input including my own. I
also have created a mailing list with about 20 names (I will add your name
too) for the purposes of doing a Schonfeld DNA project. Perhaps I  should
ask that we use  that mailing list to send this type of correspondance.
Attached is the latest (about 2 years old, but with a few modifications
during that time) Schonfeld chart in Gedcom 5.5


Louis


-----Original Message-----
From: moishe@langsam.com [mailto:moishe@langsam.com]
Sent: Tuesday, October 31, 2000 10:52 AM
To: Louis Schonfeld
Subject: Tzvi Elimelech Schonfeld - Were there TWO?!



Hi,
Can you take a look at
<http://www.ics.uci.edu/~dan/genealogy/Miller/spira/hm-shnfd.htm>
and tell me where you think it fits?
------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Mon, 6 Nov 2000 09:39:20 -0500 (EST) 
From: Marge Schechner  
To: "moishe@langsam.com"  
Subject: RE: Your ancestry.. 
X-Mailer: mail.com 
X-Originating-IP: 24.6.179.52 


Hi,
In response to your letter:
Sylvia Schoenfeld Neff's oldest living sibling was Bertha Schoenfeld
Goldheir, born 1898. Bertha was named for her grandmother, Bella Richter
Schoenfeld, wife of Tzvi Elimelech.
There was a child born about two years before Bertha, named Harry(Hersh
Melech or Tzvi Elimelech) born about 1896 or 97 but he died at age 6
months.Bertha and Harry were born in Boryslav.


Moses Schoenfeld was born in Boryslav in 1867.
Rose Schreier Schoenfeld was born in Drohobycz in 1876.


I have no information regarding any of my grandfathers siblings. Family
story is that he was the 8th of 10 children born to Tzvi from his second
wife, Bella. The first two children were from the first wife and were left
with her parents in Hungary when he married Bella. I have the names of
several of Moses nieces and a nephew.
Abraham Schoenfeld; accompanied my grandmother to the US in 1912 and was
then 22 years old. He married a woman named Rose and they had two children.
Esther Zukerman Magid came here in October, 1912 on the Kaiser August
Victoria with my mother's five older siblings. She married a man named Max.
Esther Weisman, a niece, married to a man named Moishe. Had 3 children named
Irving, Hannah (b.1912), and Bella (b.1906) married a man named Harold Cohen
who changed the name to Cole.


I can only guess as to when Bella and Tzvi died since my grandparents named
their first two children after them. My mother told me that Tzvi's yartzeit
was on 28 Tevet and I would assume that he had died by the time Harry was
born in 1896.Bella's yartzeit is 1 Shevat. Mom's only brother, Joseph, who
died in 1990 gave her this information.


Marge


Please indulge me. Can you supply years of birth (and place) for the
following:


Sylvia Schoenfeld Neff
The name of Sylvia Schoenfeld Neff's oldest sibling, and her year of birth


Moses Schoenfeld
Rose (Schreier) Schoenfeld


Do you know the 10 children of Tzvi Elimelech and Bella Richter Schoenfeld?
Who was the oldest? born what year?


-Moishe
____________________________________________________________________
-----Original Message-----
From: moishe@langsam.com [mailto:moishe@langsam.com]
Sent: Wednesday, November 08, 2000 2:12 AM
To: Louis Schonfeld
Subject: Stropkov Schonfeld



Louie,


Anything ever come of this?
-Moishe




>Date: Thu, 13 Jan 2000 02:38:18 +0100
>From: Schmuelik 
>X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [de]C-CCK-MCD QXW03200  (WinNT; U)
>X-Accept-Language: he,de,en
>To: Moishe@langsam.com
>Subject: Schonfeld Slovakia
>
>dear Moshe
>
>my name is shmuel Rubens , 48 years old , Born in Israel
>and living in Germany ( now 18 years)
>
>I research the roots of my family
>my father Walter rubens came from Berlin Germany
>his grand grand father ( mother side)  Hermann Schoenfeld
>died in Waagneustadl Slovakia
>
>we got some days ago his death certificate
>there he is called tzvi hersch Schonfeld , born 19 shvat (6.2.1804) in
>Stropkov Slovakia
>
>I have looked in to different census lists of zemplen county and found
>that sara
>spira which appears in your Spira family tree was married to a Moshe
>Schoenfeld
>from Medzilaborce.
>----------------
>http://www.ics.uci.edu/~dan/genealogy/Miller/spira/bny-yscr.htm
>---------------------
>do you have some information maybe on the family of Moshe Schonfeld ?
>I suspect he might be from the family of my GGGfather Herman ( tzvi
>Hersh Schonfeld )
>you mention in your web site that his father was called eliezer .
>can you tell me in what source did you find this connection ?
>may be I can use it to continue researching on the ancestors of Zvi
>Hersh Schoenfeld
>
>by the way you can see this death certificate on the web :
>under :
>-------------------------
>(left part )
>http://www.familytreemaker.com/users/s/h/m/Rubens-Shmuel/PHOTO/0004photo.ht
ml
>
>and (right part)
>http://www.familytreemaker.com/users/s/h/m/Rubens-Shmuel/PHOTO/0005photo.ht
ml
>
>
>
>Best Regards and I hope to hear from you when you have time
>( there is some life beyond family research ...)
>
>bye and Best Regards , shmuel

___________________________________________________________________
From: "Louis Schonfeld"  
To:  
Subject: RE: Stropkov Schonfeld 
Date: Wed, 8 Nov 2000 08:47:21 -0500 
X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) 
Importance: Normal 


This too is in process. Are you aware of the family of Naftali Yeshaye Asher
Schonfeld from Hanusovce nad Taplou? The secular documents refer to him as
Nathan, and he is also called Naftali by contemporaries. His father was
Menachem Mendel (or some variant) who is assumed to be the brother of Moshe
Schonfeld from Medzilaborce. The family has a Tzavah from NYA which states
that they are descendants of the B.Y. Not necessariyly from Moshe ben
Eliezer but from another daughter. Elizabeth Schonfeld Feder is their family
historian. Her brothers Louis Schonfeld (Yekutiel) lives in Flatbush (less
than 5 minutes away from you) and Baruch Schonfeld also from Flatbush.  I
mentioned your name to her. Also, fee free to use my "Schonfeld subscriber"
list to disseminate any relevant information you wish. All the individuals
who I have mentioned plus a number of others are on this list.


Best
Louie

___________________________________________________________________
Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2000 09:21:30 -0500 (EST) 
From: Marge Schechner  
To:   Moishe Miller 
Subject: RE: Many new Schonfeld descendants added 


Hi,
As per Louis's request, I am sending my Schoenfeld tree, what I know of it,
to the list.


I am Margery Neff Schechner. My mother is Sylvia Schoenfeld Neff, the 8th
child of Moses and Rose Schreier Schoenfeld. Her siblings are/were
Harry (Hersh Melech)Schoenfeld,born about 1896 and died in infancy.
Bertha Schoenfeld Goldheir,born-1898, died-1973.
Rae Schoenfeld Weinstein,born-1900, died-1981.
Joseph Schoenfeld, born 1902, died-1990
Matilda Schoenfeld Teitelbaum, born-1904, died-1990
Lillian Schoenfeld Spitzer, born 1906
Hannah Schoenfeld Cukell, born 1913
Sylvia Schoenfeld Neff, born 1914


My grandfather, Moses, was born in 1867 in Boryslav to Tzvi Elimelech and
Bella Richter Schoenfeld. He was the 8th of 10 children. He died in 1944 in
New York City.
My greatgrandfather, Tzvi Elimelech had a first wife who died after giving
birth to two children who were left with his dead wife's family in Hungary.
Tzvi died sometime before 1896 since my grandparents named their first
child,Harry,for him. Bella died before 1898 since my Aunt Bertha was named
for her.
Unfortunately, I do not know the names of any of my grandfather's siblings
but have several of his nieces' names and one nephew. Abe Schoenfeld, born
about 1890, married a woman named Rose and lived in New York after 1912.
Esther Zukerman arrived in New York in 1912 and married a man named Max
Magid. Esther Weisman was another niece, married to a man named Morris
(Moishe) Weisman. They had three children; Irving, Belle ,born about
1906,(who married Harold Cohen/Cole) and Hannah, born about 1912.
There is another name in the family tree, Dora Bien, wife of Henry Bien, but
I do not know how she fits in.


Marge Schechner

___________________________________________________________________
Date: Sat, 20 Jan 2001 05:07:55 -0500
To: Schmuelik ,lmagyar@en.com, Marge Schechner  
From: "moishe@langsam.com" 
Subject: Re: [Fwd: Schonfeld Slovakia]

Dear Shmuel, Marge and Louie,

Actually, after re-reading everything at
http://www.familytreemaker.com/users/s/h/m/Rubens-Shmuel/PHOTO/0004photo.html
and
http://www.familytreemaker.com/users/s/h/m/Rubens-Shmuel/PHOTO/0005photo.html
 I can tell you based on the death entry on your site that Shmuel's "Tzvi Hersh Schonfeld" 
 was 69 when he DIED (not born) on Feb 6, 1874, which corresponds to 19 Teves, 5634. The 
 date of Feb 6 1804 is 24 Shevat, 5564. The death record on your site does not show BIRTH 
 date, only DEATH date. 

Also, this is not the same Tzvi Elimelech from Marge Schechner, who says that "My mother 
told me that Tzvi's yartzeit was on 28 Tevet and I would assume that he had died by the 
time Harry was born in 1896". Obviously the two yahrtzeits, 28 Tevet and 19 Teves do not 
match. 

Can the three of you offer any direction?

-Moishe
moishe@langsam.com

___________________________________________________________________


• Pesach Moshe and Bracha Weinberger

From: Berthacam@aol.com 
Date: Tue, 25 Jul 2000 04:09:40 EDT 
Subject: Spira Genealogy-The Bnei Yissochur 
To: Gesher Galicia SIG <galicia@lyris.jewishgen.org> 
Reply-To: bertha schwarz <berthacam@aol.com> 



I was in Israel and went to the cemetery to find my GreatGrandfather's grave. 
It says;  R. Nechemia Weinberger the Son of R. Pessach Moshe Weinberger and 
Grandson of Bnei Yssochur from Dynov.


I like to know who was his mother of Nechemia Weinberger. Nechemia Weinberger 
was born in Dynov  in  l863 and died in Bnei Berak Israel. in l960 .


Thank you for your help.


Bertha Schwarz

-------------------------------------------------------
From: Daniel Teichman <106607.620@compuserve.com> 
To: Gesher Galicia SIG <galicia@lyris.jewishgen.org> 
Cc: Bertha Schwarz <Berthacam@aol.com>, Moishe Miller <moishe@langsam.com> 
Subject: Re: Spira Genealogy-The Bnei Yissochur 
Date: Wed, 26 Jul 2000 14:09:16 +0200 
X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 


Dear Bertha


Wellcome to the club of descendants of R' Zvi Elimelech SPIRA (was LANGSAM)
from Dynov, called the Bnej Jisass'char, after his most famous book (I am
not one of his descendants, but my wife and our children are).


The best place to look for this family is the website of Moishe Miller
(descendant of a brother of R' Zvi Elimelech miDynov):  www.langsam.com


Checking the website I could not find anything about your Weinberger family.
Louis Schonfeld, also a descendant of the Dynover Rebbe) has Weinbergers in
his family tree
(http://www.familytreemaker.com/users/s/c/h/Louis-Schonfeld/tree1.html), but
they don't fit to your informations.


I would be much interested in the actual text on the gravestone. Is it in
Hebrew? How is the connection described exactly?


I found out about the connection of my family with the Dynover Rebbe by an
obituary of her grandfather, where it said: "He was a grandson of the
Dynover Rebbe". After many years of complicated research I found out that he
was not a grandson, but a greatgreatgrandson! Things are even more
complicated because one of the Dynover's granddaughters (my wife's ancestor)
married the widower of her aunt (the Dynover's daughter). (see details on
Moishe Miller's website:
http://www.ics.uci.edu/~dan/genealogy/Miller/spira/uri.htm)


Best regards


Daniel Teichman
Zurich, Switzerland
----------------------------------------------------------------
X-Sender: pesach@mail.langsam.com 
Date: Wed, 26 Jul 2000 16:04:01 -0700 
To: Gesher Galicia SIG <galicia@lyris.jewishgen.org> 
From: moishe@langsam.com <moishe@langsam.com> 
Subject: Re: Spira Genealogy-The Bnei Yissochur 
Cc: Bertha Schwarz <Berthacam@aol.com> 


Dear Bertha,
Welcome indeed!
After looking through my info, the best I can find so far is the following.
R' Hersh Mylech Spira had a daughter Beila, who was first married to R' Nechemia, 
son of Tzvi. He drowned in a river during his father-in-law's lifetime. Beila 
subsequently married R' Shimon Yeshaya Reich, ABD Ludomir. She had one known 
child from each spouse. The child from Nechemia was Mechla , married Levi Yitzchok.
They had 1 known child:Michal Weinberg . See this info at
http://www.ics.uci.edu/~dan/genealogy/Miller/spira/bny-yscr.htm#L3.2


Can you provide some more background on your own ancestry. What is the lineage 
between yourself and R. Nechemia Weinberger?


Does anyone else come from the Langsam/Spira/Miller/Eckstein tree? The roots 
are primarliy Galician and northern Slovakia in the first half of the 1800's


-Moishe Miller
moishe@langsam.com
www.langsam.com
------------------------------------------------------------------
From: Berthacam@aol.com 
Date: Wed, 26 Jul 2000 19:50:11 EDT 
Subject: Re: Spira Genealogy-The Bnei Yissochur 
To: moishe@langsam.com 
X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 112 



Dear Moshe Miller:


I am still not clear about the response I got from you but we will try 
together to solve this puzzle.


My Mother was a granddaughter of R. Nechemia  Weinberger on her mother's 
side. 
I know that R. Nechemia's mother was called BABA BRUCHA .  I am named after 
her  and so is His granddaughter living in Israel.  We had in our family many 
girls named after the grandmother.  R. Nechemia Weinberger had 6 daughters 
and on son Fishel was his name.  They all moved from Poland to Cologne 
Germany in the early 1900  I think from Pzemizel (Galicia)  .


I am trying to find out from Germany when the whole family moved from Poland  
from what town or city  to Cologne Germany.


Hope this will give you some information and can help to solve our mystery.


Best regards, 

Bertha Schwarz 
---------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Wed, 26 Jul 2000 21:06:12 -0700
To: Berthacam@aol.com, galicia@lyris.jewishgen.org
From: moishe@langsam.com <moishe@langsam.com>
Subject: Re: Spira Genealogy-The Bnei Yissochur
Bcc: Daniel Teichman <106607.620@compuserve.com>,  
	 <hosp@voicenet.com>,<Neil185@aol.com>,<levy@eye.ch>, 
	 Louie Schonfeld <lmagyar@en.com>, Abraham J Heschel <binmoses@juno.com>,
	 Bertha Schwarz (Bnei Yissochur) <Berthacam@aol.com>, 
	 djw@bio.bu.edu, momcactus@email.com

Hi,

Let's try it this way:
What is your mother's name, first and surname (maiden)
What were her parent's names and surnames
Your mother's grandfather was Nechemia Weinberger, born 1863. How may children 
did he have and what were their names?
Nechemia's father was R. Pessach Moshe Weinberger. His mother was Brucha. What 
was her maiden name? How many children did she have and what were their names?


This information can help us determine how you fit in the tree.

In the Encyclopedia, Me-orei Galicia, Volume 2, pages 828 and 826, it refers to 
a R' Mordecahi, of Dinov and Belz, 1870 - 1942, as a grandson of the Bnei 
Yissochur. It says that he married the daughter of R' Volf Weinberger, and
then changed his own surname to Weiberger. 

It list two sons of R' Mordche:
R' Yehoshua (1894-1966) 
R' Elazer, who died in an accident involving metal (I can not make out the 
whole story. It seems that there may have been another brother, that had a 
son Yakov, that donated a Sefer Torah in his memory).

The R' Yehoshua, son of R' Mordche has three sons:
R' Shlomo of New Jersey
R' Dov Zev of Willaimsburg, NY
R' Pesachya Meir of New Rochelle, NY

Do you know these people?

-Moishe
moishe@langsam.com
---------------------------------------------------------------
X-Sender: pesach@mail.langsam.com 
Date: Wed, 26 Jul 2000 21:16:20 -0700 
To: Gesher Galicia SIG <galicia@lyris.jewishgen.org> 
From: moishe@langsam.com <moishe@langsam.com> 
Subject: Re: Spira Genealogy-The Bnei Yissochur 


Hi,
Ome more thing; Pesach Moshe is not a common name combination. I scanned 
Ancestry.com and found  lisadan@internet-zahav.net researching a Pesach 
Moshe Koifman. Perhaps she is a connection to you?

-Moishe
moishe@langsam.com
www.langsam.com
------------------------------------------------------------------
From: Mehadrin@aol.com 
Date: Thu, 27 Jul 2000 11:16:52 EDT 
Subject: Re: Spira Genealogy-The Bnei Yissochur 
To: moishe@langsam.com, Lmagyar@en.com 
X-Mailer: AOL for Macintosh sub 28 



In a message dated 7/26/00 11:56:06 PM, moishe@langsam.com writes:


>The R' Yehoshua, son of R' Mordche has three sons:
>R' Shlomo of New Jersey
>R' Dov Zev of Willaimsburg, NY
>R' Pesachya Meir of New Rochelle, NY
>
>Do you know these people?
>
Dov Zev is Rabbi Bernard Weinberger, the rabbi of the Young Israel in 
WIlliamsburg who was written the family ancestry in the introduction to his 
books "Shemen Hatov" his brother, Rabbi Shlomo Weinberger is the rabbis of 
Tifereth Israel-the Galitzianer Shul in Passaic N.J., and the brother 
Pesachya is still in New Rochelle. I think their mother is still alive 
although of a very advanced age. I know both the Willimasburg and Passaic 
brothers, and am sure they would be happy to give you further information.
A. Marmorstein 
------------------------------------------------------------------
From: Berthacam@aol.com 
Date: Thu, 27 Jul 2000 22:06:07 EDT 
Subject: Re: Spira Genealogy-The Bnei Yissochur 
To: moishe@langsam.com 
X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 112 




Hi,


Here is the information so far of Nechemia Weinberger;


My Mother's name was Dora Teitelbaum-Krulik
Her maiden was Dora Ksias
Her Mother's name was Leah Weinberger
Her Husband's name was Ychiel Ksias
My Great Grandfather's wife name was Sara Kelner
They had 6 daughter, and one Son
The name of the daughter were:
Leah (My Grandmother) , Beti, Miriam, Rivka, Mina, Pesia and one Son Fischel 
Weinberger.  


  My understanding is that  Nechemia's Mother ( Berucha) her  maiden name was 
Spira she married Pessach Weinberger. I do not know    how many children  she 
had beside Nechemia.  This is the information I am looking for.


I hope it makes it a bit clearer for you now.


Thank you for your help

Bertha Schwarz 
----------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Thu, 27 Jul 2000 23:36:02 -0700
To: Berthacam@aol.com
From: moishe@langsam.com <moishe@langsam.com>
Subject: Re: Spira Genealogy-The Bnei Yissochur

Hi,
It makes it MUCH clearer. Did you ever hear of Rabbi Bernard (Dov Zev) 
Weinberger from Willaimsburg, in Brooklyn, New York. His grandfather 
(Mordche, born 1870) was from Dynov/Belz. He is a grandson of the Bnei 
Yissochur. I called him at home and left him a message. 

Also, what were the married names of:
Beti, Miriam, Rivka, Mina, and Pesia 
Who did  Fischel marry?
 
Let's keep searching together.....
-Moishe
-----------------------------------------------------------
From: Berthacam@aol.com 
Date: Fri, 28 Jul 2000 06:14:21 EDT 
Subject: Re: Spira Genealogy-The Bnei Yissochur 
To: moishe@langsam.com 
X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 112 


HI,


I am not familiar with the name of Rabbi Bernard Weinberger from 
Williamsburg, Brooklyn New York.


The married names of Miriam was Weinberger and so was Mina. Miriam Weinberger 
married her cousin  Shemuel Weinberger by the same family name.  She died 
after her son's birth David.  Shemuel Weinberger married her sister Mina.  
They moved from Cologne to Bnei Berak in l936 with 3 children.  David, Moshe 
and Bracha. 
Shemuel and Mina are buried in Bnei Berak and on their graves it says that 
they are the great grandchildren of Bnei Yissochur.


Pesia Weinberger married  Israel Weisman.  After he husband died she 
remarried to  a man name Tuvia Holichitz in Israel.  She is 92 years old and 
lives in Israel.


Fischel Weinberger married Rosa Lerer they had 4 children Rivka, Miriam, 
Channa, and Yaacov. (They died in the Shoah)


Rivka Weinbeger married Yaacov Recker they did not have any children
  (They died in the Shoah)


Bety Weinberger married Hirsch Abent.  They had 4 children Clara, Norbert, 
Dora, Berte.  Clara and Norbert were twins. ( They died in the Shoah)   


My grandmother Leah Weinberger married Yechiel Ksias they had 4 children 
Dora(my mother) Moshe Adele and Menachem.  My grandparents dies in the Shoah 
.  My mother, Adele and Moshe survived and lived in Israel.  Moshe died very 
young in Israel .


I gave you a lot of information and hope that will make it a bit easier to 
connect the weinberger family
From my understanding Bracha Shapira married Pessach Weinberger . 


Best regard

Bertha Schwarz 
--------------------------------------------------------------
From: Phyllis Kramer <phylliskramer1@worldnet.att.net> 
To: Gesher Galicia SIG <galicia@lyris.jewishgen.org> 
Subject: Re: Spira Genealogy 
Date: Tue, 1 Aug 2000 11:03:01 -0700 


> Bertha Schwarz wrote in part:
>
> >I was in Israel and went to the cemetery to find my
Great-Grandfather's
> >grave. It says: R. Nechemia Weinberger the Son of R. Pessach
Moshe
> >Weinberger and Grandson of Bnei Yssochur from Dynov.
> >
> >I like to know who was the mother of Nechemia Weinberger.
Nechemia
> >Weinberger was born in Dynov in l863 and died in Bnei Berak
Israel in l960.


Don't know if this will help, but i noticed in Zmigrod there were
birth registrations for many SPIRAs, as follows:
Spira, Chaskel, 12/22/1914, , , parents: Chiel Spira, Sara Leser
Spira, Feiga, 11/20/1866, , , , Scheija Rose
Spira, Itte, 8/21/1889, , , Josef Spiro, Niche Rek
Spiro, Breindel, 3/20/1885, , , Josef Spiro, Niche Rek
Spiro, Dwore, 12/18/1881, , , Josef Spiro, Niche Rek
Spiro, Leib, 2/5/1883, , , Moses Josef Spiro, Blume Kurzman
Spiro, Markus, 8/3/1884, , , Hersch Spiro, Chaje Raber
Spiro, Markus Lipe, 7/15/1888, , , Josef Spiro, Niche Rek
Spiro, Race, 1/7/1882, , , Hersch Spiro, Chaje Raber


Regards,
Phyllis  (phylliskramer1@att.net) of Wilton & Savannah
Searching KRAMER, WISNER, BEIM  from JASIENICA (Galicia)
STECHER, TRACHMAN, FEIR, KORNREICH from ZMIGROD (Galicia)
http://www.jewishgen.org/shtetlinks/zmigrod/zmigrod.htm
LINDNER, MAUER, BERLIN, EICHEL from ROHATYN (Galicia)
http://www.jewishgen.org/shtetlinks/rohatyn/rohatyn.htm
SCHEINER, KANDEL, SCHIMMEL from Strzyzow, Dubieko (Galicia)
http://www.jewishgen.org/shtetlinks/kolbuszowa/strzyzow/strzyzow.h
tm
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Fri, 03 Nov 2000 21:59:31 -0800
To: Berthacam@aol.com
From: "moishe@langsam.com" 
Subject: Re: My great Gand Father Nechemia Weinberger

Hi,

Thanks for your patience. 

R' Hersh Mylech had seven children. See
http://www.ics.uci.edu/~dan/genealogy/Miller/spira/bny-yscr.htm
for detail.


The Yeshiva is at
Rechov Shaul Hamelech 17
P O Box 6789	
02 5815631 - 5812951

You might also talk to 
Akiva or Aryeh Leib Gottlieb
Rechov Imrei Bina 20
02 5386737
They are from the Uri family and seem to have some genealogical contacts.

Please,please keep me informed of your progress and any other cousins 
that might be interested in writing to me. 

Lastly, I would like to address your ancestry again. Can you supply years 
of birth (and place) for the following:
Sylvia Schoenfeld Neff
The name of Sylvia Schoenfeld Neff's oldest sibling, and her year of birth

Moses Schoenfeld
Rose (Schreier) Schoenfeld

Do you know the 10 children of Tzvi Elimelech and Bella Richter Schoenfeld? 
Who was the oldest? born what year?

-Moishe


At 07:16 PM 11/5/00 -0500, Berthacam@aol.com wrote:

Thank you for your advice.  I like to get more information on that Yeshiva in 
Jerusalem that you recommended  to get more information Derech Pikudecha.

Do you have the names of the daughters of Zvi Elimelech Shapiro ?  I have not 
found yet any information on any of them.

 By the way a book written by Zvi Elemielch  by the name of Derech Pikudecha  
dated 1851 in Limber.  We found this book at the Widener library at Harvard 
University.

Hope to hear from you soon again.

Bertha Schwarz 
_________________________________________________________________________
From: Berthacam@aol.com 
Date: Sun, 10 Dec 2000 21:37:09 EST 
Subject: Re: Weinberger family 
To: moishe@langsam.com 
X-Mailer: Windows AOL sub 117 



Thank you for helping.  My great-grandfather Nechemia Weinberger came from 
Dynov. His wife's name was Bruchu (Bracha) .  From what I was told by my 
mother, she was the daughter of Zvi Elimelch Shapiro from dynov.  


My mother's aunt Mina was married  to Shemuel Weinberger who's bother's name 
was  Fischel Weinberger the Rabbi of Yad Eliahu in Israel.  On page 826 of 
R.Wunder's Encyclopedia   There is a picture of him.  Shemuel Weinberger he 
lived in Bnei Berack since 1936.  Mina was his second wife.  He married his 
first wife sister. who died at childbirth.  I understand that Shemuel 
weinberger and Mina (his wife) were cousins. 


I have a picture of Nechemia Weinberger tombstone.  He was buried in Bnei 
Berak and so is Shemuel and Mina Weinberger. 


I hope that this will make it clearer to you what I am looking for.


I do know that some of the family moved to Muncaz Hungary but am not clear 
yet who.
Bertha Schwarz 
______________________________________________________________________
From: Berthacam@aol.com 
Date: Tue, 12 Dec 2000 07:54:04 EST 
Subject: Re: Weinberger family 
To: moishe@langsam.com 
X-Mailer: Windows AOL sub 117 



Hello,


Your am planning to do just that, to get a death certificate and immigration 
papers of Nechemia Weinberger when I will be in Israel next time.


I just looked again at the photo I took last year of the tombstone of 
Nechemia Weinberger it says the following;
R. Nechemia Weinberger the son of Pessach Moshe Weinberger the grandson of 
Bnei Yissochor from Dynov.
On Shemuel Weinberger tombstone it says; the son of R, Jacob 
 the great-grandson of Bnei Yissochor.
On the tombstone of the daughter of Nechemia Weinberger it says;
Chana Mendel Weinberger, the daughter of Nechemia and Sara the 
great-granddaughter of Bnei Yissochor.  Shemuel and Chana Mendl were husband 
and wife.  It seems to me that Nechemia Weinberger's mother was names Bracha 
and not his wife.
Nechemina Weinberger was my mother's grandfather. 
I hope that will make it clearer to find more information on the family tree.


Thanks again for your help.
Bertha Schwarz. 
______________________________________________________________________

Date: Sat, 11 May 2002 23:30:27 -0400
To: Berthacam@aol.com, drlobel@netvision.net.il, 
    lisadan@internet-zahav.net , gailf@ofld.com , 
	drkush@concentric.net, cohentalk@aol.com, mweinbe@IUPUI.edu, 
From: "moishe@langsam.com" <moishe@langsam.com>
Subject: Weinberger Family Update

Dear All,

It has been some time since we have written and I just wanted to bring 
you up to date on where my WEINBERGER research is holding. 

I have recently uncovered some new information that seems to link us more 
closely. Bertha wrote of her great-uncle being married to a Roza Lehrer. 
This family turns out to be descendents of PESACH MOSHE and BRACHA 
Weinberger. This means that the NECHEMIA that Bertha Schwartz and Dr.
Judith Lobel come from had a sister named RIVKA. This Rivka married 
Shmuel Lehrer and had Rosa (and others). 

I have been in touch with several descendents of Rivka, living in the NY 
area and Antwerp too. They also know that Rabbi Fischel Weinberger of Yad 
Eliyahu in Israel and his brother Shmuel were cousins. Their father was 
Yakov. He may have been either a brother or nephew to Nechemia and Rivka.
This connection is only a guess right now. I am trying to contact somebody 
from that family to find out the name of Yakov's father. 

So, so far we have Brucha and Pesach Moshe with two children, Nechemia and 
Rivka. They possibly had another named Yakov. Also, please remember that 
the Bnei Yissochur (1783 - 1841) was named R' Hersh Meylech Spira. He was 
married to Chane Mindel, surname unknown. They had seven children. You can 
view this list at
http://www.ics.uci.edu/~dan/genealogy/Miller/spira/bny-yscr.htm

Now, getting back to bringing us altogether. Bertha wrote about some of the 
family going to Munkacz. Linda Cohen wrote about some Weinberg/er family that 
came to the USA from Munkacz. Maybe somebody can supply more information on 
this part.There may be some connection there. 

There is the Pesach Moshe Koifman, that I am hoping lisadan@internet-zahav.net
will tell us about.

Most importantly, Gail Furst wrote about a Hersh Meylech Weinberger who had
a daughter named Chana Mindel, born in Dubiecko. This family MUST be related, 
having the names of both the Bnei Yissochur and his wife in their family. 
Perhaps somebody can supply a contact to Moishe Gewirtz or some other family 
members from this branch. Also, Gail, can you supply an approximate time frame
for when Hersh Mylech Weinberger lived? It may be that he was yet another 
sibling to Nechemial and Rivka. 

Going back to the beginning, once again, the parents of Nechemia and Rivka 
were Pesach Moshe and Bracha. I have no proof as to which one was the 
Weinberger. In those days, it was not uncommon to only have a Jewish 
wedding ceremony, with no corresponding civil record. This would 
usually result in the children retaining the maiden name of the mother.
In our case, there are possibilities. It might be that Pesach Moshe was 
named after the father of the Bnei Yissochur, whose name was Pesach. It 
might be that Bracha was the connection. If she was, it might be that she 
was a daughter of Baila, who was the daughter of the Bnei Yissochur. There 
is no evidence that the Bnei Yissochur had more than the seven known children,
Bracha NOT being one of them. Also, given the dates involved, she would have 
been to old to have been his child. Of course, Bracha could have been almost 
any else's child too.

I hope that we can work together to try and put more of this into place. I
have recorded much of out earlier emails and they can be found at
http://www.ics.uci.edu/~dan/genealogy/Miller/spira/brknspir.htm

I will try to review the ship records available at the Ellis Island website 
for any possible new leads.

Please respond, at least to let me know your own thoughts on how to continue
from here.

Sincerely,
Moishe Miller
moishe@langsam.com 
__________________________________________________________________________
For an overview of Pesach Moshe and Bracha's two known children Nechemia and Rivka, please see their trees.

R' Fischel Weinberger
In Rabbi Meir Wunder's encyclopedia of Galician Scholars , II:824, he mentions a (Ephraim) Fischel Weinberg (1912 - 1964). A picture is included. He was born in Przemysl to Yakov, a chasid of Dynow-Belz and a descendant of the Bnei Yissochur. This Ephraim Fischel married Chana Teumim, daughter of R' Zev Teumim, ADMUR Zaleshchiki. When R' Zev passed on in 1931, the two candidates for succession were his son-in-law, R. Fishel Weinberger of Przemysl, and R. Mordechai Sprecher, a rabbinical judge. Neither was elected and both subsequently served as rabbinical judges with the title ABD.

Fischel's wife and children perished in the Holocaust and he alone escaped to Israel in 1944. In 1946 he married Rivka Kliers and accepted the post of Rabbi of Yad eliyahu, next to Tel-Aviv. He had a brother Shmuel in Bnei Brak, who passed away 29 October 1974. Shmuel was married to Weinberger family as well.

Perhaps Fischel and Shmuel's father, Yakov, was also a son of Pesach Moshe and Bracha Weinberger.

In the sefer Bnei Ephraim he writes of his lineage. This was published by his sons Yakov, Moshe of Bnei Brak, his step-daughter, Devora Shvadron and Chana Goldberg.

__________________________________________________________________________


R' Hersh Mylech Weinberger of Berlin

Date: Tue, 19 Dec 2000 20:51:15 -0500
To: gailf@ofld.com , drkush@concentric.net, cohentalk@aol.com, mweinbe@IUPUI.edu, 
From: "moishe@langsam.com" 
Subject: Weinberger's from Dynow and Mukachevo

Dear Fellow Researchers,

I saw your posting in the JGFF at JewishGen. Perhaps we share a mutual interest. I am looking for 
a Weinberger family that connects to R' Hersh Mylech Spira, author of the Bnei Yissochur, and many 
other Hassidic works. 
There appears to be (at least) two Weinberger branches intertwined with the Spira family. One 
originates with Nechemya Weinberger, son of Pesach Moshe. The other is with a Naftali and Perel 
Reich, grandchildren of Beila Spira. 

-Moishe Miller
moishe@langsam.com

www.langsam.com 
______________________________________________________________________
From: Cohentalk@aol.com 
Date: Thu, 21 Dec 2000 11:37:12 EST 
Subject: Re: Weinberger's from Dynow and Mukachevo 
To: moishe@langsam.com 
X-Mailer: 6.0 sub 171 

Dear Moishe, 

Sorry but I don't have more than my great aunt's maiden name 
Mary Weinberg/er who married my grandfather's brother Samuel Katz. 
They immigrated to NYC about 1905 from Munkacs. 

We live in Michigan.  When I was I child, there was on 'old' lady we 
called Perel (phonetically--> Perel ainy)  She may have been from 
the Hollander or Spira family.  My grandmother, (maiden name Eisenberg) 
said the woman was a cousin (I think!) --Perel could have been 
connected to Katz or Eisenberg or Weinberg--my Baba claimed 
everyone! 

Sorry I can't help more. 

Happiest Holidays to You and Yours, 
Linda Cohen 
______________________________________________________________________
From: "Gail Faust"  
To:  
Subject: Re: Weinberger's from Dynow and Mukachevo 
Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2001 17:52:12 -0500 
X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 


My  husband's uncle was named after a Hersh Meylech Weinberger. He had a
daughter named Chana who was my husband's grandmother. She was born in
Dubiecko.- the Weinbergers were from a religious family with many rabbis.
There is a relation by the last name of Gervirtz in New York. Do you think
that there is any connection?
Gail Faust

______________________________________________________________________
From: "Gail Faust"  
To:  
Subject: Weinberger 
Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2001 13:00:17 -0500 
X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 


Dear Moishe,
I am in the process of obtaining the Weinberger family history from a Weinberger relative 
from New Jersey. I will give you all the info that I have right now.
 
Hersh Mylech Weinberger from Dubiecko had two wives. He had a wealthy brother who lived in 
Berlin and had a street named after him. Weinbergerslass. I don't know anything else about 
his siblings or parents. Hersh had two sets of children from each wife.
There was a daughter Chana(my husband's grandmother), a son Chaim(lived in New York and had 
children Robert, Gail Lester, Susan Hiller).There were other brothers and sisters and half 
brothers and sisters.One half sister lived in Israel.
Chana Weinberger married Reuben Faust and moved to his home town of Sedziszow where they 
had 5 children. Ben(Dov Ber), Mendel, Pearl(Perel), Harry(Hersh Mylech), Morris(Moses). They 
went by the name Weinberger growing up and changed their name back to Faust after the war 
because the parents were only married by jewish law.
I noticed in the Spira family tree that David Spira had daughters that lived in Sedziszow.
 
The Weinbergers were a  large religious family with many rabbis. They lived in all the 
surrounding towns near Dubiecko.
 
There is a Moishe Gewirtz that lives in New York now . I was told that he had two wives and 
lost family in the Shoah. 
There are other Weinberger family members in the USA mainly New York,New Jersey area.I hope 
to have more info soon to make the connection with you.
 
Gail Faust
______________________________________________________________________
From: "Gail Faust"  
To:  
Subject: Re: Weinberger 
Date: Sun, 7 Jan 2001 19:12:14 -0500 
X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 


Dear Moishe,
I just got off the telephone with the last surviving child of Chana
Weinberger Faust. He is the one named Hersh Mylech. He confirmed that his
mother's name was Chana Mindel and that he was from a rabbinical family. I
don't where to go from there until the Weinberger relative comes through
with all the more recent information. I will keep in touch.
Gail Faust
__________________________________________________________________________
From: Harry Gewurz  
Subject: Fw: WEINBERGER/ GEWURZ 
Date: Tue, 20 Jul 2010 17:20:53 -0400 
To: moishe@langsam.com 
Cc: gailf@ofld.com 
 
Dear Reb Moishe,
 
I have just come across your great Research.
 
My Name is Hersh Meilech Gewurz, I am the son of Reb Moishe Gewirtz, My Father's Mothers 
name was Malka & her Father was Reb Hersh Meilech Weinberger.
 
I would be intrested to know how Reb Hersh Meilech Weinberger was connected to the 
B'nai Yissoscher was it thru Weinberger or thru Shonfeld ?
 
Looking forward for your respond.
 
Harry Gewurz
__________________________________________________________________________
I called him instead of email on
Tisha b'Av 2010
July 19, 2010

This is what Harry told me:

Moshe - born in Sanok, Sep 1 1918 - 2003 (NY)
lived in east Flatbush and married there. He was a Mashgiach for meat
In 1960 they were in Crown Heights already but moved back in 65, until 72 to East Flatbush
In 1972 they moved to Boro Park on 18th and 50th.

Moshe is the son of
Malka Weinberger (sister to Phillip - he had no children) and Dov Gewurz (died in 1920). 
Dov was a son of Moshe Gewurz, and ben-bais by Bluzower Rebbe.
Malka and Dov had Moshe and also had 2 dtrs:
* Hentcha or Esther (shot By Nazis in the very beginning of the war. She was evicted from 
  the house by the Nazis and she went back. They shot her).
* other one is unknown, she died young and caused Dov's death.

Malka passed away in Siberia
Her father was Hersh Mylech Weinberger

Moshe claimed he came from the URI mishpacha.
Also that Malka and Dov were first cousines, but the 
connection to the Bnei Yissoschur was only based on Malka 

After Siberia Moshe lived is Estreich. 
He married a Wasserstein who died during childbirth, with the child.
She has a sister, married to Binyomin (Yumtchi) Goldstein.

Moshe's second wife is Perel Ganzfried, and they have Hersh Mylech (Harry). 
Harry lives at 777 Kent Ave, in Williamsburg, Brooklyn, NY



Pesha Horowitz/Stockholmer
Pesha Horowitz/Stockholmer (1894 - 1979) was married to Avrohm Zusha Ziskind. According to her family, she was a descendent of the Bnei Yissochur. In an attempt to determine the connection, the following is presented.

Pesha and Avrohm Zusha had three children; Sholom Ber, Leah, and Yechiel. Pesha's parents were Dovid Horowitz of Estila, Galicia and Leah Halcer (c. 1878 - 1946).
Pesha's two siblings were Mindel and Zissel

Dovid's parents were Yechiel and Pesha Horowitz. This Horowitz family was of direct paternal descent from the ShL"Ah. Leah's father was R' Zev Halcer. Leah may have had a brother Mayer.

The family beleives that the connection may be within the branch of R' David Spira, son of R' Hersh Mylech.


Chana Mindel Kutten

Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2000 21:14:04 -0500
To: joshrin@worldnet.att.net
From: "moishe@langsam.com" 
Subject: Chana Mindel Kutten

	Hi!

Saw your posting at www.ancestry.com of your family tree. Would you be able to elaborate 
at all on the entry in your family tree for "Chana Mindel (Nudel/Kutin) \\"? She seems 
to have been a descendent of R' Hersh Mylech Spira, married to Chana Mindel. 

Thanks for posting!
-Moishe Miller

moishe@langsam.com 
__________________________________________________________________
Date: Tue, 05 Dec 2000 07:57:45 -0500 
From: Joyce Oshrin <joshrin@worldnet.att.net> 
Reply-To: joshrin@worldnet.att.net 
X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en]C-WNS5.0  (Win98; I) 
X-Accept-Language: en 
To: "moishe@langsam.com" 
Subject: Re: Chana Mindel Kutten 


I have no idea what Chana Mindel's maiden name was. 
None of her children ever wrote it down. Her son 
married a Meislish.


See chart that's attached.


Joyce
nudle.jpg

__________________________________________________________________
Date: Tue, 05 Dec 2000 16:03:31 -0500
To: joshrin@worldnet.att.net
From: "moishe@langsam.com" 
Subject: Re: Chana Mindel Kutten

Hi,
Thanks for the quick response. I am unclear on your response. 
Her married name was NUDDLE. However, on the image you sent, 
it says NUDDLE/KUTIN. Where does the KUTIN mean? I am guessing 
that she may have been a daughter of Yitzchok Kutten. Can you 
put me in touch with any of her offspring?

-Moishe Miller
moishe@langsam.com
__________________________________________________________________
Date: Wed, 06 Dec 2000 06:32:22 -0500 
From: Joyce Oshrin <joshrin@worldnet.att.net> 
Reply-To: joshrin@worldnet.att.net 
To: "moishe@langsam.com"  
Subject: Re: Chana Mindel Kutten 


Chana Mindel was left a widow when she was 9 months pregnant with her
second child. (Her husband shot himself in his leg to get out of the
army and died of gangrene. She gave birth while she was sitting shiva.
Her mother-in-law took the the baby to raise and and Chna and her
daughter Molly retruned to her home town where she married Kutin.  Some
of teh children took the name Nuddle when they came to the US. The one
cantact I had in the US died in a tragic hotel fire years ago.


Some are in Argentina. I haven't heard from them in over 15 years. They
are my husband's family. I wrote to them and they didn't know any
information. 
Zelig Kutin, Chana's husband and Chana had:
Abraham
Anna
Dvora
Yasha
David
Motelmlived in Argentina
Zelda married Motel Szelman -children were doctos in Argentina

Can't help you further. All the contacts I had are dead now. 
__________________________________________________________________
Date: Wed, 06 Dec 2000 23:11:47 -0500
To: joshrin@worldnet.att.net
From: "moishe@langsam.com" 
Subject: Re: Chana Mindel Kutten

Hi,
Thanks for your fascinating response. Would you be kind enough to keep 
me in mind, should anything develop further?

Good Luck in your endeavors,
-Moishe Miller
moishe@langsam.com
__________________________________________________________________


Benzion Spira
Avrumi Schonfeld claims to descend from the Bnei Yissochur, via Sara Schonfeld nee Spira (1807 - 1878). His brother, Moshe, confirmed this. He gave the family lineage from his father, Mordechai (c1915 - 1994), son of Moshe Shmuel (died circa 1920 in Tarnopol, Galicia) and Rifka (nee Seidman), son of Benzion. Using the JRI-Index for Tarnopol, a family tree was created. Click here to view it.

__________________________________________________________________

From: "Abe schoenfeld" <abe.schoenfeld@worldnet.att.net> 
To: <moishe@langsam.com> 
Subject: it was nice talking to you today 
Date: Sun, 15 Jul 2001 20:48:49 -0400 
X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2014.211 


it was nice talking to u today. I need to ask my brother what info he has 
and see where u can fill in the missing info
__________________________________________________________________
Date: Mon, 16 Jul 2001 00:20:00 -0400
To: "Abe schoenfeld" <abe.schoenfeld@worldnet.att.net>
From: "moishe@langsam.com" <moishe@langsam.com>
Subject: Re: it was nice talking to you today

Hi,
Likewise!

Please review:
http://www.ics.uci.edu/~dan/genealogy/Miller/spira/bny-yscr.htm

Also, can you start by just telling me your direct SCHONFELD that you do 
know? Your father's name, grandfather's, g-grandfather's, etc?

-Moishe

www.langsam.com

__________________________________________________________________
From: "Abe schoenfeld" <abe.schoenfeld@worldnet.att.net> 
To: <moishe@langsam.com> 
Subject: Re: it was nice talking to you today 
Date: Tue, 17 Jul 2001 23:22:50 -0400 
X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2014.211 


Mordechai (father)
Moshe Shmuel (grand father)

__________________________________________________________________
Date: Tue, 17 Jul 2001 22:35:52 -0400
To: "Abe schoenfeld" <abe.schoenfeld@worldnet.att.net>
From: "moishe@langsam.com" <moishe@langsam.com>
Subject: Re: it was nice talking to you today

Moshe Shmuel's father???

__________________________________________________________________
From: "Abe schoenfeld" <abe.schoenfeld@worldnet.att.net> 
To: <moishe@langsam.com> 
Subject: Re: it was nice talking to you today 
Date: Sun, 22 Jul 2001 19:20:58 -0400 
X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2014.211 


Bentzion

__________________________________________________________________
Date: Sun, 29 Jul 2001 23:42:23 -0400
To: "Abe schoenfeld" 
From: "moishe@langsam.com" 
Subject: Another question...

Sorry, but I still do not place you on the tree. Can you supply years of birth/death 
for Bentzion? 
Do you know HIS father's name?
-Moishe

__________________________________________________________________
From: "Abe schoenfeld"  
To:  
Subject: Re: Another question... 
Date: Mon, 30 Jul 2001 09:35:13 -0400 
X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2014.211 


I need to ask my brother he has some kind of list prpeapred by someone in
chicago

__________________________________________________________________


Chana Mindel Stern nee Langsam
The Stern family, descended from Chana Mindel Langsam, married to Chaim Stern, claims to be from the Bnei Yissochur. It would seem that Chana Mindel's father, Chaim Leib Langsam was married to a female descendent. At least three of his grandchildren were named Tzvi Elimelech.

My own theory is that he was not the son of Pesach Langsam, but the grandson (or further). This would make it more plausible for him to be on the same generation as the Bnei Yissochur's grandchildren.

Further indication of this is the birth of his oldest child occuring in 1830, making him about 53 at the time. It would be far more convincing to make his birthdate two decades or more later.

In any event, his actual connection to the Bnei Yissochur is still unknown. __________________________________________________________________


Perel Simon
In March of 2002 Rabbi Moshe Tovia Weissberger of Kiryat Sanz, Israel, outlined his wife's ancestry. He said that she is somehow a descendent of the Bnei Yissochur.

Moshe          |  Leah
Deutsch        +  ?
               |
               |
		Pinchus Shlomo |  Perel
		Simon          +  Ehrenfeld
		c1900 - ?         c1912 - c1994
From: "moishe@langsam.com" 
Subject: Mako, Hungary & Ehrenfeld and
Halperin/Halpert family

Hi,

Rabbi Moshe Tovia Weissberger of Kiryat Sanz, Israel contacted me regarding
his wife's descent from the Bnei Yissochur, R' Hersh Mylech Spira (1783 -
1841). He did not know the exact connection but was hoping to learn it. I
was unable to help but thought maybe someone from our group could further
identify or add genealogical material. He related the following:

His wife, Rivka SIMON, is the daughter of Pinchus Shlomo SIMON and Perel
EHRENFELD (1912 - 1994). This Perel was the daughter of Tzvi EHRENFELD and
Kreindel HAPLERIN (or HALPERT) of Mako, Hungary. Rabbi Weissberger believes
that the connection is probably via this Kreindel, whose parents were Yona
Zev Ha'Levi, the shochet in Mako, and Esther BERENSTEIN (daughter of Yakov
Yitzchok Ha'cohen and Margolit Rivka, also of Mako, Hungary). Yona Zev was
originally from Mukachevo before going to Mako. His parents were Akiva and
Esther.

Incidentally, the Pinchs Shlomo SIMON mentioned above was the son of Moshe
and Leah DEUTSCH, also of Mako, Hungary. 

If anybody can shed more light on this family or there connection to R'
Hersh Mylech SPIRA, please contact me.

Thanks!

Moishe Miller
___________________________________________________________________________________
On Sun, 23 Oct 2005 17:54:33 +0200
"Halpert Moty"  wrote:
 Dear Mr. Moishe Langsman
 Moaadim Le'simha

 My name is Mordehay Shlomo Yona Halpert, My father Moshe, His fathers' name Yaakov, 
 His grand father Yona from Mako. I know all the people mentione din the following 
 data base. I visited the synagogue in Mako last June and found the original chair 
 of my grand grand Father where it was placed.

 Rabbi Moshe Tovia Wiesberger is now in position in Budapest leaving near by the 
 orthodox sinagouge in Dob Utza.
 
 I am looking for ay information about my Father's sisters 
   Halpert Rozsa, born in OCT. 1st, 1921, 
   Halpert Szerena (sara) born May .3rd 1925
   Halpert LILLA lili Born July 29 1926.
 
 I am looking for any information about the above and their brother:
   Halpert Kalman born in 1920
   their father's name was YIZAK JAKAB
   their Monther's name was Mindle (Shwarts from home)
 
 I am looking also for My Father's first cusin's sister, Her Name is Gita she was 
 married with Hershi-Zvi Greenfeld (now she is in Los Angeles. We are looking for
 her sister: Fine Erzsabeth Born April 2nd 1924 in Mezokvacshaza, her fater named 
 SALAMON mother: SCHWARTZ ESTER.
  
 If you have any information regarding the above, I will
 appreciate to get any commnets or hint.

 For any question please contact me through the email or
 skype(halpertm) or 972-50-5331117

Thank you
Hagg Samech
Moty Halpert
___________________________________________________________________________________

Subject:  Tracing Connection back to Bnei Yissaschar 
From:  Avi Lowell  
Date:  Sun, Jan 11, 2015 4:54 pm 
To:  moishe@langsam.com 
 
  
It was just the yorzeight Friday of the Bnei Yissaschar and I got interested to see if
I can help find the missing pieces to trace the family back.Here's what I know:My mother 
Leah Lowell (Lilli or Lila Gelbart) had mentioned that we are connected somehow.  

She said something about being from the first munkatcher Rebbe but not the second. Also, 
that her father (Moshe Gelbart - the schochet in Hamburg) father's mother was a shapiro 
from Tarnow.The first Munkatcher Rebbe was a grandson of the Bnei Yissaschar and was a 
Rav in Tarnow before moving to Munkatch.  His name was Shlomo and he was born in 1831 and 
died in 1893.I think my mother's maiden name of Gelbart may have been switched from Halperin 
and I was looking for a female ancestor born a shapiro from Rav Shlomo or maybe his father 
who married a gelbart or Halperin.i was reading the emails below and noticed some interesting 
information - though not sure how it is connected.1. My mother Lila Gelbart was born around 
1942 was born Lili Gelbart - similar to Lilla Halpert born 1926 below. 2. The name Moshe 
Halperin is similar to my grandfather moshe gelbart3. I was told that he comes from generations 
of schochtim.Any information or leads is much appreciated.

AviMoshe Lebowitz 
 

__________________________________________________________________


Moshe Kalter, son Ahron

Ahron was niftar first day Shavous (Sivan 6) 1995. He was a Kohain.
The SS death index lists him as
ARON KALTER  
  SSN 105-32-0363 Residence:  11204  Brooklyn, Kings, NY 
  Born 12 Aug 1904 Last Benefit:     
  Died 3 Jun 1995 
 
His father was Eliyahu Yehuda. 
__________________________________________________________________


Pesach/Philip Weinberger

The Blazowa Chevra Kadisha Society lists a Pesach ben Tzvi Elimelech Weinberger
that passed away 8 Shevat 5732 (January 24, 1972). This is obviously connected 
to the family. The Bnei Yissoschur was Tzvi Elimelech and his father was Pesach. 
Also, there are quite a few Weinberger families that connect to the family. Some
of thier roots are known and some are not, although they have tradition that they
do descend from the Bnei Yissoschur.

Cross-referencing the surname and death date with the Social Security death index
produces one result:

Name        Birth         Death      Last Residence         Last Benefit     SSN         Issued 
PHILIP      18 Aug 1897   Jan 1972   11691 (Far Rockaway,   (none specified) 058-28-8019 New York 
WEINBERGER                                  Queens, NY)     

__________________________________________________________________


Schonfeld from Medzilaborce area

__________________________________________________________________
>On Thu, 25 Mar 2004 16:50:47 EST
> "ariel fischer"  wrote:
>> there are schonfelds in monsey who are from the bnei
>> yissoschor. do you want
>> to contact them?
>
>
__________________________________________________________________
>Hi,
>
>Thanks for your offer. The answer is yes, if they are not
>kids from Yanky (son of Pesach Dovid) Schonfeld.
>
>Moishe

__________________________________________________________________
From: "ariel fischer"  
Sender: afischer@bestweb.net 
Subject: Re: bnei yissoschor 
Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2004 17:36:31 EST 
To: "moishe@langsam.com"  
 
 
 
you can write to carolengelman@hotmail.com Her maiden name is 
schonfeld. She has a brother in Israel. Just make sure to write 
bnei yissoschor in the "subject" or she will delete it as spam 

__________________________________________________________________
From: "moishe@langsam.com"  
Subject: Re: bnei yissoschor 
Date: Fri, 02 Apr 2004 01:09:14 -0500 
To: afischer@bestweb.net,"moishe@langsam.com" , 
carolengelman@hotmail.com  
 
 
Hi,

Can you tell me how you descend from the Bnei Yissoschur? I
have an extensive website on the family at www.langsam.com
and would be very interested in knowing where you "fit" on
the tree.

Chag Samayach!
Moishe Miller
moishe@langsam.com 

__________________________________________________________________
From: "carol engelman"  
Subject: Re: bnei yissoschor 
Date: Fri, 02 Apr 2004 08:21:23 -0500 
To: moishe@langsam.com 

hello:

As I understand it, we descend from the Bnei Yissoschur through his 
daughter.  My father will be here for Yom Tov and I will, bli 
neder, ask him to explain the exact link.  I will then let you 
know.

Wishing you a chag kasher v'sameyach,

Carol Engelman

__________________________________________________________________
From: "moishe@langsam.com"  
Subject: Re: bnei yissoschor 
Date: Fri, 02 Apr 2004 11:04:15 -0500 
To: "carol engelman"  
 
 
Hi,

Thanks for your reply. If you look at one of my webpages,
at
http://www.ics.uci.edu/~dan/genealogy/Miller/spira/bny-yscr.htm
you can see that the Bnei Yissoschur had a daughter Sara
that married Moshe Schonfeld. His known children were:
R' Pesach Avrohm , Lazar , Pessil , Yitta Leah , Mordechai
Yosef , Rivka , Shimon , Asher , Bracha , Mirel Lifsha , R'
Zvi Elimelech

Can you ask him which one you come from? Also, I may be
able to connect you anyhow, if you just tell me the names
of your father's parents.

Chag Sameyach!
Moishe 

__________________________________________________________________
From: "carol engelman"  
Subject: Re: bnei yissoschor 
Date: Thu, 15 Apr 2004 09:38:59 -0400 
To: moishe@langsam.com 

Hope you had a good Yom Tov.

My father's name is Aharon David.  His father was Shlomo and his 
mother was Shari/Shaindel/Sara Ashkenasy.  The father of Shlomo was 
also Aharon David and his wife's name was Leah.  My father thinks 
that the father of Aharon David may have been Chaim Yankel, but 
he's not sure.  He will check with his cousin whose name is Chaim 
Yankel (Weisz - in Toronto) to see if he knows.  When I showed my 
father your email, he said that the name Zvi Elimelech rang a bell, 
but he's not sure.  My grandfather, Shlomo, had an older brother 
named Avraham, so I thought perhaps that came from Pesach Avrohm.  
My father's uncle Avrohom Schoenfeld was a Rav in Aiud (Rumanian 
pronunciation) or Enyet (Hungarian pronunciation).  Avrohom and 
Shlomo had two sisters, Rivka (Weisz) and Sara (Ganz).I'll let you 
know when I get more information.  Please let me know if anything I 
just told you fits what you know.

Carol Engelman

__________________________________________________________________
>From: "moishe@langsam.com"  
>To: "carol engelman"  
>Subject: Re: bnei yissoschor 
>Date: Thu, 15 Apr 2004 12:40:55 -0400 
> 
>Hi, 
> 
>The information you supplied is wonderful! Unfortunately, I 
>can not yet make a connection. Can you supply dates of 
>birth/death for your great-grandfather, Aharon or his wife 
>Leah? 
> 
>Do you know where they (your great-grandparents lived)? 
> 
>Moishe 
__________________________________________________________________
From: "carol engelman"  
Subject: Re: bnei yissoschor 
Date: Thu, 15 Apr 2004 13:48:17 -0400 
To: moishe@langsam.com, fivelovi@yahoo.com 
 
 
My father just left to return to Florida, so I'll have to ask him 
these questions later.  My father and his father grew up in 
Timisiora which was Hungary and then Roumania.  I believe my 
grandfather's father was from Poland.  I'll check with my father.  
My father has a cousin in Israel, a wonderful lady named Mutzi Roth 
(she's the sister of Chaim Yankel, whom I referred to earlier).  
Since women are usually very good at keeping track of family trees, 
I'll give you the email of her grandson, Hagai.  Hagai Fivelovitz's 
email is fivelovi@yahoo.com.  Maybe they can help.  I'll let you 
know what I learn and would appreciate being informed if you find 
out anything new.

Kol tuv,

Carol Engelman

__________________________________________________________________
From: "moishe@langsam.com"  
Subject: Re: bnei yissoschor 
Date: Thu, 15 Apr 2004 16:56:30 -0400 
To: fivelovi@yahoo.com.  
Cc: "carol engelman" ,  
 
 
 
Dear Hagai, 

I am an amateur genealogist and have been working with
Carol to try and determine if we are indeed related via the
Bnei Yissoschur (R' Hersh Mylech Spira, 1783 - 1841). Carol
has outlined the ancestry, back to her great-grandparents,
Aharon and Leah Schonfeld. Their children were Shlomo,
Avraham, Rivka (Weisz) and Sara (Ganz).

Can you supply dates of birth/death for Aharon or his wife
Leah? Do you know where they lived? Do you know their
parents or siblings, or can you establish the exact
connection your family has to the Bnei Yissoschur?

I have a website on my family history and the SPIRA part
can be found at:
http://www.ics.uci.edu/~dan/genealogy/Miller/spira/spira.htm

I think that your branch probably comes from Sara SPIRA,
married to Moshe SCHONFELD. 

Moishe 

__________________________________________________________________
From: Hagai Faivlovitz  
Subject: Re: bnei yissoschor 
Date: Fri, 16 Apr 2004 01:53:00 -0700 (PDT) 
To: "moishe@langsam.com"  
 
 
 
dear Moishe,
yeshar coach for your website, it's very exciting to know your 
roots. my grandmother -mutzi - Miriam Roth(weisz) came from 
SCHONFELD family.

she told me that her grandmother was shlomo Aharon , and he was 
grandson of bnei yissoschor , probably . mutzi also had 
great-grandmother babe gittel . she ask me to give you her phone 
number (972-9-7602357), she is not using Internet, she is 77 years 
old , here in Israel , if you want to hear more details about 
family .

in addition , she said her brother from Toronto, haim yankel(jack) 
weisz , know more about all . please let me know if i would help 
something .

what about reunion of old people of all part of family? do you know 
where we all lives . for instance , we are live is us, Canada, 
Israel, London, Costa-Rica.

that all, meanwhile.

be in touch

hagai faivlovitz(Roth)
972-2-6794305
62 shimoni st. , Jerusalem 92630 

__________________________________________________________________


Rimalt and Teitelbaum from Dobromil

The encyclopedia Meorei Galicia cites the ABD Dobromil, R' Avraham Mordechai Rimalt 
as being a son-in-law of the Bnei Yissoschur. This is the limited tree that is presented:
				
	1  	Avraham Mordechai Rimalt	c.1790 - 1854	
.		+girl ?		
........	2  	Elimelech Menachem Rimalt	1820 - 1867	
..................	3  	Avraham Mordechai Rimalt	1861 -	
............................	4  	girl Rimalt		
................................		+Shlomo Teitelbaum	- c.1942	

Professor William Low is researching (he is #78872) RIMALT from Dobromil and Khyrov. 
He lives at:
Hapisga 5 /15
Jerusalem, 95456
Israel

__________________________________________________________________
From: Professor William Low <williaml@cc.huji.ac.il> 
Subject: Re: Rimalt from Dobromil 
Date: Sun, 29 Aug 2004 18:46:18 +0200 
To: "moishe@langsam.com" <moishe@langsam.com> 
 
 
 
Dear Mr. Langsam

Thank you for your note. Somehow the name Langsam strikes a familiar
cord. I remember that in my youth this name was mentioned.

The Rimalt family is my mothers family. The Dobromil branch I met in
1934 or 1932 when I visited Rabbi Teitelbaum in Dobromil. My grandfather
Rabbi Zvi Hirsh Rimalt sent me from Chyrov to visit him.

After the war I had some contact with his daughter who survived the
holocaust and wa able to save some of the manuscript on the Shulchan
Aruch either from her father or grandfather.

I enclose in Hebrew - if you can read it the genealogy of the Rimalt
family. It is not complete and some things are still cropping up
We visited Chyrov, Dobromil and Zolkiew a few years ago. There is
nothing left from what I remember

Shana Tova

W. Low

Please let me know more about yourself and how you are related 

                      File: YICHUS.3.doc (164Kbytes) 
__________________________________________________________________
From: "moishe@langsam.com"  
Subject: Re: Rimalt from Dobromil 
Date: Mon, 30 Aug 2004 21:35:34 -0400 
To: Professor William Low  
 
Hi,

By the way, have you reviewed JewishGen's Poland database?
There are index records for names that look like you would
be interested in.

Also, my connection to all this is via the Bnei Yissoschur
(my g-g-g-uncle). I am a direct descendent of Pesach
Langsam. 

The Bnei Yissoschur's known children can be seen in my
website at:
http://www.ics.uci.edu/~dan/genealogy/Miller/spira/spira.htm

You (and Rabbi Wunder in Meorei Galicia) claim that R'
Rimalt was a son-in-law of the Bnei Yissoschur. I find this
unlikely as there were only seven known children, all
accounted for. More likely is that he was a
"grandson"-in-law, married to one of the Uri children,
maybe as a second marriage. R' Yakov Uri was a son-in-law
of the Bnei Yissoschur and was ABD of Turka.

What are your thoughts?

Moishe 

__________________________________________________________________
From: "William Low"  
Subject: Rimalt from Dobromil 
Date: Tue, 31 Aug 2004 23:03:14 +0200 
To:  
 

Briefly these are the answers.

The reference to the connection of Rimalt of Dobromil is in the attached
document which seems to be reasonably reliable. May be you could follow this
up

I have not been in contact with the Teitelbaum family. Rebbezin Halberstam
probably does not live anymore. Her relative I think her son-in law used to
live in Boropark and the last address I had was 829 47th Street and
telephone number 718 8530359. She survived the war and has many stories
about my grandfather and about Dobromil.

You probably know more about the Bnei Yissaschar than I. As you see from the
date he died about 173 years ago

I do not have the website of the Jewish Ge'n Poland database . Can you give
it to me

????? ?????? ????

??? ???? ???? ???? ??
Professor William Low
Telephone 972-2-6436517 972-2-6584266
FAX: 972-2-6436788
Home address: Hapisga 5A/15 Jerusalem

 
                File: Quote from ???? ?????? page 135.doc (19Kbytes)  

__________________________________________________________________
From: "H Said" <hfsaid@hotmail.com> 
Subject: RE: Rymald 
Date: Tue, 31 Aug 2004 14:09:00 +0000 
To: moishe@langsam.com 
 
 
 
Shalom,
I don't have too many thoughts on RYMALD...nor much information either. I have 
a family photo which includes my Avrum Rymald, his wife, mother-in-law & children. 
According to my late mother, Avrum made taleisim for a living, loved to travel (& was 
said to have even visited Eretz Yisroel), & did next to nothing to support his family. 
His mother-in-law Beila was my grandmother's stepmother - she lived with her daughter in 
Bobov, & my grandfather sent them money from the US until Beila died just before the war. 
To the best of my knowledge the whole family was killed in the holocaust. The only 
documentation I have for that is records from Belgium that tell of Avrum's son Hershel 
(who worked as a diamond-cutter) being sent for forced labor & eventually being deported 
to Auschwitz. The records show that his wife (a cousin) & 5-yr old dgtr were deported on 
a different date. A cousin here in Israel once told me that there was a related Rymald 
family here. 1 of this family was a cabinet minister many years ago - I think his name 
was Elimelech. So maybe all these people are cousins, but (as my elderly aunt used to 
say) you can't prove it by me...Is Dobromil anywhere near the Bobov-Gorlice-Tarnov 
area?

Best wishes for a Shana Tova,
Chana Saadia

PS Do you want a copy of the photo? 
Rymald family


Diller and Milstein from Dynow (Brzozow)

Chana Mindel Milstein (Millstein) nee Diller was born in Dynow, Poland in 1870 to Tzvi and 
Pesel. She was a shop owner and married to Anshil. Prior to WWII she lived in 
Dynow, Poland. During the war was in Dynow, Poland. Chana Mindel died in the 
Holocaust. This information is based on a Page of Testimony submitted by her 
granddaughter, Sara Scharf, of Shedrot Kugel 22, Holon, Israel, in 1973 and 
1986. This is the actual page of testimony.

Other names subitted by her are:
Chava Magram nee Milstein was born in Dynow, Poland in 1900 to Anshil and Chana. 
She was married to Chaim. Prior to WWII she lived in Dynow, Poland. During the war 
she was in Dynow, Poland. Chava died in Siberia Geo region, Russia. Sara Scharf was 
her sister-in-law, Sara Scharf.

Eva Schlau of Holywood, FL, submitted info on:
Chana Mindel Muehlshtein was born in Dynow, Poland. Prior to WWII she lived in Dynow, 
Poland. Chana died in the Shoah. This information is based on a Page of Testimony 
submitted by her granddaughter.

Aharon Muehlshtein was born in Dynow, Poland to Chana Mindel. Prior to WWII he lived 
in Dynow, Poland. Aharon died in the Shoah. This information is based on a Page of 
Testimony submitted by his niece.

Chava Muehlshtein was born in Dynow, Poland to Chana Mindel. Chava died in the Shoah. 
This information is based on a Page of Testimony submitted by her niece.

Zisl Muehlshtein was born in Dynow, Poland to Chana Mindel. Prior to WWII she lived in 
Dynow, Poland. Zisl died in the Shoah. This information is based on a Page of Testimony 
submitted by her niece. 

__________________________________________________________________
In Libby Warren's website, at: http://maxpages.com/nodabyehuda/My_Family_Roots
it states:
My great-great grandparents: R' CHAIM FROIM (EFRAIM) LANDAU born in Dinov(APPROX 1830-1890) 
and TOBY DILLER = THEY LIVED IN DINOV (DYNOW). HER FATHER WAS R' BORUCH DILLER of DINOV; HER 
GRANDFATHER WAS R' SIMCHA DILLER who was from a shtetl near SANOK and is buried in the old 
cemetary in Sanok. Toby Diller's siblings were: R' WOLF DILLER who was a SON-IN-LAW OF REBBE 
REB HERSH MEILECH OF DINOV , ITZIKEL DILLER A DAYAN IN STRIZINSK, YITKE DILLER MARRIED TO 
YITZCHOK WOLF DILLER (a cousin) of Sanok, and SOSHE DILLER MARRIED TO SHMUEL WASSERMAN. 
CHAIM FROIM AND TOBY had 2 children: 1) Zishe born in Dinov, lived in Rimanov, Poland. Zishe 
had 2 sons who came to Sponscien prior to World War II to help my grandparents and their 
family: 1a) Leibish 1b) Moshe 2) Yitzchok Shmuel. Chaim Froim Landau was the son of Yehuda 
Leibish Landau, and the father of Yitzchok Shmuel Landau and Zishe. 

__________________________________________________________________
Subject: The JewishGen Family Finder: WEINBERGER
Date: Fri, 23 Jul 2004 10:18:35 -0500
From: moishe@langsam.com (Moishe Miller)
To : Etan  Rand, tonbon@aol.com (researcher code 57995)
Subject : The JewishGen Family Finder: WEINBERGER
=======================================================
Hi,
I saw your JewishGen posting and am wondering if we might have a connection. Does your family 
have the names Pesach, Chana Mindel or Tzvi Elimelech (Hersh Mylech) in it? We had Weinberger 
cousin's that descended from the Bnei Yissoschur of Dynow (1783 - 1841).

I have a website at www.langsam.com that details some of the families that connect. Some of my 
Weinberger pages in the site are at
http://www.ics.uci.edu/~dan/genealogy/Miller/spira/brknspir.htm
and
http://www.ics.uci.edu/~dan/genealogy/Miller/spira/bny-yscr.htm

Thanks!
Moishe Miller
moishe@langsam.com
__________________________________________________________________

From: Jacobrand@aol.com 
Subject: Re: Fwd: The JewishGen Family Finder: WEINBERGER 
Date: Fri, 23 Jul 2004 13:54:04 -0400 
To: Tonbon@aol.com 
Cc: jrand@montefiore.org 
 
 
 
Just Tzvi Elimelech.

To my knowledge, the lineage is as follows:
David Rand (Munkacs 1917- Brooklyn 2000)
son of Yaakov Tzvi Rand (born in Turka 18??- died in Munkas ~192?)
grandson of Tzvi Elimelekh ("Hersh-Maylekh") Diller
grandson of Tzvi Elimelekh Spiera of Dynow (1783-1841) (author of 
B'nai Yissoschor)

Our Weinberger connection is through Yaakov Tzvi Rand's wife and 
David Rand's mother: Feige Elka Rand (b.?-killed 1944 Auschwitz) 
who was born a Weinberger. Other people in her family included her 
nephews - Usher Yoineh (the Temishvarer Rebbe) and Alter (The 
Turker Rav). Other people in her family were named Nooteh, Shimon 
and Berish. 

__________________________________________________________________

From: Jacobrand@aol.com 
Subject: Fwd: The JewishGen Family Finder: WEINBERGER 
Date: Sat, 24 Jul 2004 23:34:52 EDT 
To: moishe@langsam.com 
Dear Moishe,
I got this from my son Etan. Here is what I have been told. Do you have 
a Diller or Rand in your tree?
Jacob Rand  (Yaakov Tzvi Tuviah - son of David Rand and father of Etan)
 
__________________________________________________________________
In a message dated 8/12/2004 8:42:57 PM Eastern Standard Time, moishe@langsam.com writes:
Hi,

The info I have is slightly different than what you present
(see attached .pdf file). Yakov Tzvi Rand' father was
Shmuel Zanvil Rand. I have this info from the Encyclopedia
Meorei Galicia, 5:393 (by R. Meir Wunder of Jerusalem).
This Shmuel Zanvil Rand was married to the daughter (name
unknown) of Tzvi Elimelech Schonfeld and Bayla Kallush. 

You can see some of this at my website, via www.langsam.com
or my overview page just on SPIRA within the site at
http://www.ics.uci.edu/~dan/genealogy/Miller/spira/bny-yscr.htm

Regarding DILLER, they married into the greater LANGSAM
family, but I do not know how. 

Regarding WEINBERGER, there are several connections to the
SPIRA clan, although some can not trace all the way back.

What is your exact connection to all this? Can you shed
anymore light? 

Thanks!
Moishe

__________________________________________________________________
From: Jacobrand@aol.com 
Subject: Re: WEINBERGER, Rand, Spira and Diller 
Date: Thu, 12 Aug 2004 21:19:56 EDT 
To: moishe@langsam.com 
Cc: Tonbon@aol.com 
This makes sense except that my father was an excellent yichus historian 
and he told me that his father's grandfather was a Diller. We have pictures 
of Yakov tzvi and of Hersh-Maylekh Diller ( who you would say is Schonfeld?) 
that would fit in style with a late 1800's date. I am very surprised - if 
you're right then the  date of tzvi elimelech shoenfeld's date  would be 
later than his grandson Yaakov Tzvi! - Iwould have thought my dad would 
mention this.

My father had an older brother named shmuel zanvel who was probably named 
after his father.

My connection - I am the oldest of David rand's 5 children, born 1948.
Jacob
 
__________________________________________________________________
In a message dated 8/12/2004 10:03:17 PM Eastern Standard Time, moishe@langsam.com writes:
R' Wunder has had some inacuracies before (although it is
an excellent work), so I am apt to accept your version. To
fix what I have, can you tell me how your Tzvi Elimelech
connects to the Bnei Yissoschur?

Moishe

__________________________________________________________________
From: Jacobrand@aol.com 
Subject: Re: WEINBERGER, Rand, Spira and Diller 
Date: Thu, 12 Aug 2004 22:12:05 EDT 
To: moishe@langsam.com 
Cc: Fayecsw@aol.com, MJRandPhD@aol.com, ted.rand@verizon.net, randclan@NewMail.net 
My understanding was:
> > David Rand (Munkacs 1917- Brooklyn 2000)
> > son of Yaakov Tzvi Rand  (born in Turka 18??- died in
> > Munkas ~192?)
> > grandson of Tzvi Elimelekh ("Hersh-Maylekh") Diller
> > grandson of Tzvi Elimelekh Spiera of Dynow (1783-1841)
> > (author of B'nai 
> > Yissoschor)
> > 
But I will cc my sister and brothers in case they have better info.
Our only first cousin on the Rand side - Elizabeth (Faigy) Rand Grauman - 
of Silver Spring might also have some info.
Let me know what you determine,
Jacob

__________________________________________________________________
In a message dated 8/13/2004 5:25:26 AM Eastern Standard Time, MJRandPhD writes:
Hi, Yankel.
 
SOme of the facts that I got over time (not always consistent):
 
Tvi Hersh Elimelech of Dinov was the B'nai Yisooschor. - he goes back to 
the 1700's, and should be dated as a younger contemporary of the Bal Shem, 
or as a student of a disciple of the Bal Shem.
 
Diller married either a daughter or granddaughter of the Dinuver Rebbe, the 
Bnai Yisoschor. I never heard that last name. I am pretty sure that the 
lineage transferred to the Rand's rather than through the Weinberger.
 
Tati's father was 1884-1924.
 
I am pretty sure that Tati said that his mother and father were shiduched 
in a village in the Carpathians, when his father was about 20 years old, 
when one of the families came up from the Munkaczer side of the mountains, 
and the other from the Galizianer side. I forget which was which. And that 
the rand family moved into Munkacz around the start of World War I.
 
In 1920 Yaakov Tzvi Rand was arrested in Munkacz and held for about two weeks, 
because of some WW I evasion of draft service. He was according to tati turned 
in by a Jewish informer, and eventually freed by a judge, thanks to help from 
a SPielman girl. This should be in the Munkaczer court house records. According 
to tati the courthouse was at the end of Louis Kossuth street, where he had 
lived. (I have not yet been there and don't know if the geography is accurate.
 
See you in Israel at the next continuing segment of the Next Generation @ Naches.com.
 
Luv, to you all. Moish
 
Moish.

__________________________________________________________________
From: Jacobrand@aol.com 
Subject: Re: WEINBERGER, Rand, Spira and Diller 
Date: Fri, 13 Aug 2004 05:40:01 EDT 
To: MJRandPhD@aol.com 
Cc: moishe@langsam.com 

Thanks Moish,
Will forward to Moishe Langsam.
See you in Yerushalayim in good health!
Mazaltov and love,
Yankel
 
__________________________________________________________________
In a message dated 8/12/2004 10:38:00 PM Eastern Standard Time, moishe@langsam.com writes:
How does Tzvi Elimelekh ("Hersh-Maylekh") Diller connect to
Tzvi Elimelekh Spiera of Dynow ?
__________________________________________________________________
From: Jacobrand@aol.com 
Subject: Re: WEINBERGER, Rand, Spira and Diller 
Date: Fri, 13 Aug 2004 05:42:26 EDT 
To: moishe@langsam.com 

My understanding was that he was a daughter's son. I have his picture if 
that will help figure out how he fits in.
 
__________________________________________________________________

In a message dated 8/12/2004 10:38:44 PM Eastern Standard Time, moishe@langsam.com writes:
Also, when did Tzvi Elimelekh ("Hersh-Maylekh") Diller
live?
__________________________________________________________________
From: Jacobrand@aol.com 
Subject: Re: WEINBERGER, Rand, Spira and Diller 
Date: Fri, 13 Aug 2004 05:44:07 EDT 
To: moishe@langsam.com 

I don't know. My father is from Munkacs. His father is from Turka.
Have you visited either place?

__________________________________________________________________
From: Jacobrand@aol.com 
Subject: hersh maylekh 
Date: Wed, 8 Dec 2004 21:38:27 EST 
To: moishe@langsam.com 

Just following up to see if you were able to get any additional infor on 
hersh maylekh diller and how he fits in tio the family tree, Do you know 
of any other Rand connections to this tree?
 
Jacob Rand (Yaakov Tzvi)
__________________________________________________________________
In a message dated 12/12/2004 10:15:28 PM Eastern Standard Time, moishe@langsam.com writes:
Hi, 
Thanks for the follow-up. I do have some other overlap
elsewhere in the tree. Perhaps you could follow-up with
someone and let me know.

Descendants of Yehuda Spatz
                
1      Yehuda "Yidel Spatz" Spatz        
..    +girl Diller        
.........2      Genana Spatz        
.............    +Tzvi Elimelech Spira    1904 - 1975    
....................3      Chaja "Chatcha Spira" Spira 1924 -
........................+Herschel Presser        
....................3      Alter Reuven Spira    - 1942    

The last number I have for Mrs. Presser is in Brooklyn at
(718) 435 4042

For the RAND family, there is a far more extensive tree. Do
you somehow fit in?

Descendants of Mendel Rand
                
1      Mendel Rand        Bukowsko, Poland
.......2      Tuvia Rand        
.......      +Miriam Langsam        
..........    3      girl Rand    - 1942    
............        +Solomon Leiblich    - 1942    Krakow,Poland
.................    4      Ted Leiblich    1928 - 1982    
...................        +Ethlyn ?        
..........    3      Sinai Rand    - 1930    
............        +Sara Fischel    1867 - 1916    
.................    4      Jacob Rand    1890 - 1962    
...................        +Netti Gold    1895 - 1966    
........................    5      Israel Rand    1918 - 1944    
..........................        +Goldie Schwartz        
........................    5      Eleazer Rand    1920 -    Rydal, Pa
..........................        +Paula Neiman        
..........................        *2nd Wife of Eleazer Rand:        
..........................        +Carol Green        
........................    5      Sally Rand    1923 -    
..........................        +Erwin Kaplan        
........................    5      Ruth Rand    1925 - 1987    NY
..........................        +Irving Ram        
........................    5      Isaiah Rand    1928 -    NY
..........................        +Beverly Krostich        
........................    5      Sinai Rand    1931 -    San Diego, CA
..........................        +Eileen Kramer        
.................    4      Yetta Rand    1892 -    
...................        +Israel Schindelheim        
........................    5      Ely Schindelheim    1918 -    
..........................        +Ruth Stern        
........................    5      Jerry Schindelheim    1924 -    
..........................        +Carol Fox        
.................    4      Lena Rand    1894 - 1979    
...................        +William "Willie" Millstein    - 1975    
........................    5      Sally Millstein        
..........................        +Irwin Wolfson        
........................    5      Eva Millstein        
..........................        +Al Schlau        
........................    5      Rita Millstein        
..........................        +Fred Cimbal        
................    4      Minnie Rand    - 1976    
..................        +Jerome Fletcher        
.......................    5      Saraim Fletcher        
.........................        +Margot Hess        
.......................    5      Georgia Fletcher        
.........................        +Henry Kufeld        
................    4      Louis Rand        FL
..................        +Ella Kantor    - 1988    
.......................    5      Sheila Rand        FL
.........................        +David Ruskin        
.......................    5      Bruce Rand        
.........................        +Marcia Grodsky        
................    4      Eva Rand    - 1920    
................    4      Arthur Rand        
..................        +Sylvia Lehrer        
.......................    5      Eva Rand        
.........................        +David Abrams        
.......................    5      Sigmund Rand        
..........................        +Rhoda Kessler        
................    4      Emanuel "Manny" Rand    - 1969    
..................        +Dorothy Dock        
.......................    5      Sandra Rand        
.........................        +Dan Teitelbaum        
.......................    5      Judith Rand        
.........................        +Martin Berman        
.........    3      girl Rand    - 1942    
...........        +Menashe Erom    - 1942    Bukowsko, Poland
................    4      child Erom    - 1942    
................    4      child Erom    - 1942    

__________________________________________________________________
From: Jacobrand@aol.com 
Subject: Re: hersh maylekh 
Date: Sun, 12 Dec 2004 23:19:14 EST 
To: moishe@langsam.com 
Cc: netnel@012.net.il, MJRandPhD@aol.com, ted.rand@verizon.net, 
	Fayecsw@aol.com, ebr9@cornell.edu, Liono0@aol.com, YRand@aol.com, RexE3@aol.com 

Yes - you've hit on something
 
Jacob and Nettie Rand brought our family to NYC  from Germany in 1949.
Sinai, one of their younger sons was remembered by my mother, Eva (Stamler) 
Rand - he would have been 2 years younger than her - and became a Professor 
of Emgineering in the Bay area (I believe Berkley).
Yetta (Rand) Schindelheim was Jacob's sister and lived in Boro Park. I 
remeber her visiting us on occasional Shabatot.
My father David Rand (born 1917-died 2000) would ask me to give regards to 
"our cousin" the bluzhever Rabbi on the winter days in Williamsburgh when 
our class met in his shul because the Yehiva hadn't paid the bill for heating  
oil (I presume this is identical to " +Tzvi Elimelech Spira    1904 - 1975").
Milstein was a name we heard frequently - especially a "Velvel Milstein"
I'm intrigued by how we fit into the larger landscape of the descendants of 
Bnai Yissoschor but am  am especially drawn to memorializing our first cousins, 
the children of my farther's siblings Velvel, Yeedel, Yossel, Zeesy, Gella and 
Shmuel Zanvil - all of who perished. We guess there must have been about 15-20 
of them, but neither my father nor uncle ever referred to them by name or 
number. Is there any way for us to gather these souls for memorialization?
Jacob
__________________________________________________________________
From: "moishe@langsam.com"  
Subject: Re: hersh maylekh 
Date: Mon, 13 Dec 2004 00:02:29 -0500 
To: Jacobrand@aol.com,moishe@langsam.com 
Cc: netnel@012.net.il, MJRandPhD@aol.com, ted.rand@verizon.net, Fayecsw@aol.com, ebr9@cornell.edu, 
	Liono0@aol.com, YRand@aol.com, RexE3@aol.com 
 
 
 
Hi,

The Bluzhever Rebber was a different Tzvi Elimelech Spira.
The prior Rebbe was R' Yisroel Spira - 1891 - 1989. His
adopted son is R' Tzvi Elimelech Spira, born 1936, lives in
Boro Park (NY) today.

Going back to your family, I too would like to have a
memory of the clan. Since you are anyhow already connected
to me via Pesach Langsam (see below for my "wrong" lineage
of your clan), let us first begin by outlining the names of
your father and his siblings, with the names of their
spouses.

Also, do you have any Israel relatives that can try to
locate this Sara Scharf in Holon?

Moishe

Direct Descendants of Pesach Langsam

1 Pesach Langsam 1748 - 1820 
 +Ita ? 
... 2 Hersh Mylech Spira 1783 - 1841 
.... +Chana Mindel ? - 1857 
....... 3 Sara Spira 1807 - 1878 
........ +Moshe Schonfeld 1810 - 1883 
............ 4 Tzvi Elimelech Schonfeld 1850 - 1927 Medzilaborce, Slovakia
............. +Bayla Kallush 
................. 5 girl Schonfeld 
.................. +Shmuel Zanvil Rand 
........................ 6  Yakov Tzvi Rand 1884 - 1924 
.......................... +Feige Elka Weinberger 
............................... 7  David Rand 1917 - 2000 
..................................... 8  Jacob "Yankel Rand" Rand 1948 - 

__________________________________________________________________
From: moishe@langsam.com [mailto:moishe@langsam.com] 
Sent: Monday, December 13, 2004 12:14 AM
To: undisclosed-recipients:
Subject: DILLER from Dynow

Hi,

I saw your JewishGen posting and was wondering if you could
tell me a little bit more about your DILLER interest. I am
interested in a Chana Mindel Millstein nee DILLER, born
1870 in Dynow. I think her husband was Anshil. A
granddaughter by the name of Sara Scharf was living in
Holon, Israel in 1986.

She was related to R' Hersh Mylech Spira, the Bnei
Yissoschur and Pesach LANGSAM.

Thanks!
Moishe Miller
moishe@langsam.com
__________________________________________________________________
From: Renee Steinig  
Subject: RE: DILLER from Dynow 
Date: Mon, 13 Dec 2004 00:49:05 -0500 
To: moishe@langsam.com 
 
 
 
Hi Moishe,

The "tree" goes like this:

Moses DILLER b: Przeworsk, Austria (now Poland)
+Esther 

...Abraham DILLER b: 10 Dec 1869 Przeworsk d: 11 Oct 1942 Theresienstadt 
...+Mirl REIFER b: 08 Aug 1866 Sieniawa, Austria (now Poland) 

......Pinkas DILLER b: 07 Dec 1892 Sieniawa d: 16 Apr 1942 Sachsenhausen 
......+Breindel? b: Abt. 1905

......Samuel DILLER b: 04 Jan 1896 Sieniawa d: 07 Jan 1943 Auschwitz 
......+Feige

......Josef DILLER b: 1898 Sieniawa

......Joachim (Chaim) DILLER b: 10 Feb 1904 Sieniawa 
......d: Aft. 24 Aug 1942 probably at Auschwitz
......+Rosa REIFER b: 04 Jul 1902 Lezajsk 
......d: Aft. 24 Aug 1942 probably at Auschwitz

.........Herman DILLER b: 09 Dec 1936 Berlin, Germany
.........d: Aft. 24 Aug 1942 probably at Auschwitz

Mirl REIFER was the sister of my mother's paternal grandfather, Zvi Hersh
REIFER. Rosa REIFER was Hersh's daughter.

The sources of my information were Arolsen records at Yad Vashem, Yad Vashem
pages of testimony, and Jewish registration records from Nazi-occupied
Belgium.

No Dynow connection that I know of, but I know little about this family.

Good luck.

Renee

Renee Steinig
RSteinig@suffolk.lib.ny.us
 
__________________________________________________________________
From: Chaya Roth  
Subject: Re: DILLER from Dynow 
Date: Mon, 13 Dec 2004 12:15:46 -0600 
To: "moishe@langsam.com"  
 
 
 
So sorry about Diller. It was my father's name from Linsk, Lucawicza, Galicia. 
I am looking too, but right now I am writing and the two are not compatible!!!
Best Chaya
But Moishe Langsam is a familiar name, from Antwerp Belgium in the diamond 
business, are you? 
__________________________________________________________________
From: FHCM1@aol.com 
Subject: Re: DILLER from Dynow 
Date: Mon, 13 Dec 2004 21:50:03 EST 
To: moishe@langsam.com 

hello - none of these names are familiar - the Diller family of which i am 
a descendant lived in Dynow, Sanok, and Brzozow (all of which I understand 
are short distances from each other and due west of Lemberg/Lvov)...... My 
grandfather's name was David Diller and he and his wife and children (Jack, 
Joe [my father], Louie and Freda) emigrated to America (San Francisco) 
between 1913 and 1921. They joined many other Diller cousins who had 
arrived in San Francisco at the turn of the century with their father Beryl 
Diller (David's brother). Unfortunately, I do not know any of the names of 
David and Beryl's aunts or uncles, nor their first cousins, so this is the 
best I can do.
 
Where are you located? It is always nice to communicate with a landzman.
 
Regards, Erwin Diller, Encino, California
__________________________________________________________________
From: Mazal1@aol.com 
Subject: Re: DILLER from Dynow 
Date: Tue, 14 Dec 2004 08:57:43 EST 
To: moishe@langsam.com 

Sorry I do not have any knowledge of the people you mention.  My grandmother, 
Esther, was a Diller.  She had two sisters, Breindal and Perel, and at least 
one brother, Yechiel Aaron, who was Shamus to the Bluzhver Rebbi.
__________________________________________________________________
From: "moishe@langsam.com"  
Subject: Re: DILLER from Dynow 
Date: Sun, 19 Dec 2004 11:05:10 -0500 
To: Mazal1@aol.com 
 
 
 
Hi,

The Bluzhever Rebber was a g-g-grandson of the Bnei
Yissoschur, so perhaps we still have a connection. Do you
know the names of Esther's parents or where they were from? 
__________________________________________________________________


__________________________________________________________________


Hersh Mylech Speigel from Humenne

On 20 October 2009, Zelig Friedman called me. He said that the previous
Bluzhower Rebbe related that they were somehow dynover einiklach.

This is what he knows:

Zeilg Friedman 347 623 3901 
son of
Shmelke Friedman (1950) + Miriam Gittel Weiss
son of
Ahron Friedman (1918 - 2005) + Tzipra Neiman (1920 born szatmar - 2003)
                                     dtr of
                                Shmuel Shmelke Neiman + Rochel Leah Speigel
                                                           dtr of 
                                                       Hersh Mylech Spiegel of Hummene + Henna
                                                        (1860 - 1880) 
__________________________________________________________________


Reiter (Zeidenfeld/Seidenfeld & Perlmutter) from Mukacheve

It seems that the claim that 
Raizel who was married to Yitzchok Isaac Perlmutter
and
Rochel Leah who was married to Naftali Seidenfeld/Zeidenfeld
were children of R' Yakov Uri and Rifka Spira or her neice, Yitta Leah
are FALSE.
However, it may still be that they do descend from 
some other branch of the Bnei Yissoschur family.

The Munkacz death record of Rochel Leah Zeidenfeld/Seidenfeld
clearly states that her maiden name was REITER and not URI or SPIRA or SCHONFELD.

The Mako and Kisvarda records from Hungary show numerous entries for PERLMUTTER 
with the mother's name being Rezi REITER.

With the assistance of Dov Weber we can conclude that
Reizel Perlmutter & Ruchel Lea Zeidenfeld were daughters of 
Yakov Eliezer Reiter & Binah, and not to the Uri family at all.

For their detail, should a new connection be found,
see their family page.

__________________________________________________________________


Orenstein from Mukacheve

From:  Sam Weiss  
Date:  Tue, May 19, 2015 2:31 pm 
To:  moishe@langsam.com 
  
I am a descendant of yuta lifsha orenstein who was born around 1850 
she was a יתומה her cousin the שם שלמה brought her to munkatz'
she is most probably a 3rd gen. of the בני יששכר
she was married to avrohom yoseph orenstein and was burred in mukats

if you would be able to give any links to get her יוחס to the בני יששכר
it would be greatly appreciated
thank you 
moshe weiss grand son of rabbi avrohom yoseph weiss

Subject:   Re: Orenstein and Bnei Yissoschur 
From: Sam Weiss  
Date: Sun, Jun 28, 2015 7:35 pm  
To: moishe@langsam.com  

 in the hungary marriage records her maiden name is jutte/ yitte gutman  
  her childerens names are chaim duvid eliezer and avrohom yosef
  
  
__________________________________________________________________



I would be very interested to hear from anyone with knowledge or an interest in the Miller family.

Moishe Miller
moishe@langsam.com

My home address is
           1374 East 28th Street
           Brooklyn NY 11210-5311
           USA

last updated 12/1/2015